Flare Sci-Fi Forums: Andromeda "Star-Crossed" Question (Spoilers)

This is topic Andromeda "Star-Crossed" Question (Spoilers) in forum General Sci-Fi at Flare Sci-Fi Forums.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://flare.solareclipse.net/ultimatebb.php/topic/8/263.html

Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :

Spoilers for the newest episode of Andromeda may be included in this post. Turn back now or scroll down at your own risk. I really don't care one way or the other.

$
$
:: Token Spoiler Space ::
$
$

All right. I'm relatively new to Andromeda. That's mainly because it's on at an unfortunate time in my neck of the woods. However, I caught "Star-Crossed" and a question popped into my head. What is the nature of Andromeda (the AI not the ship)?

A big to-do was made about her lovely android form (I think it was called an "avatar?") leaving the ship to elope. Isn't this just one of several such androids the AI can control? I know references have been made before to the effect of at any one time the AI is about 100 different robots and 'droids as well as the holographic, voice, and video versions. So isn't there like some vast store room of 'droids somewhere on that ship that contain nothing but Lexa Doig look-alikes?

Or am I completely missing the boat on this one?

------------------
God (using a Devil hand puppet): Yaagh! I'm the Devil! I'm evil! I'm spooky! I'm dark! And I'm evil! Gimme an "E!" Gimme a "V!" Gimme a "U!" Gimme an "L!" What's that spell? Evil! Goooo EVIL!
Devil: Hey, yo, that shit ain't funny!
--from Tatsuya Ishida's Sinfest

Founder, president, CEO, CFO, COO, under-secretary general, mascot, and caterer of the APAO

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

I' have yet to see an Andromeda episode, but I do know that Rommie (as she is also known) is the 'essence' (aka: avatar) of the whole ship. Think of it as one step ahead of the computer on Star Trek ships.

And she is certainly NOT an android, she is an organic based ship! But she controls a lot of androids that are on (and off?) the ship.

------------------
"We have a good arrangement. He supplies the weapons, I use them."
- Blade

Posted by Diane (Member # 53) on :

I haven't been keeping up lately, but I have seen the first several episodes. I believe the hundred or so androids you're talking about are the androids that look like robots. Andromeda didn't get her human body until a couple of episodes into the series, when the engineer-whats-his-name found the instructions to "build" her a body. I was under the impression that her body is organic, but maybe she's more like a borg.

------------------
"I was as dead as a lesbian black chick at a republican fundraiser."
--Burns Flipper, The Longest Journey

Posted by BlueElectron (Member # 281) on :

I don't get this Android thing you guys are talking about...

1. is she an extention of the ship's computer?
2. is she an completely self-sufficient robot?
3. is she an semi self-sufficient robot with some tie to the computer?

Is she as good as Data? Because frankly, I don't see a point of having her if she's just a robot with a pretty face( another word, without any special skills). I mean Data is good to have around cuz his brain is as good as any starship computer.

------------------
What is the difference between a terriorist and your girlfriend?
- With terrorist, there is a chance of negotiation.

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

She is NOT a robot!

The best thing you could compare it with is The Doctor who is tied in with every computersystem. She is a holographic representation of the ships consciousness...

Now if you call the ship a robot, then yes she I'd agree that is a robot.

------------------
"We have a good arrangement. He supplies the weapons, I use them."
- Blade

Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :

Tora Ziyal, thank you for your answer! You've just won a free date with ME! the next time you're in Houston.

If there is only one organic/physical/I-can-go-down-to-that-planet-and-all-this-other-stuff type of "body," then I can perfectly understand why the crew didn't want to see her leave the ship.

BlueElectron, this is how I see things (since I've been doing heavy searching on the Internet). We have this beautiful actress actress named Lexa Doig who played the role of "Andromeda" or "Rommie" for short. She is the Artificial Intelligence of the Andromeda Ascendent (in other words, the computer). This is a really ultimate AI entity that controls all of the ship and can control all of the ship's robots (look like little toasters on wheels to me) and androids (look like a cross between C3P0 and the robot from Metropolis). The AI has the ability to pop up on viewscreens and in areas of the ships as a hologram, much like the doctor.

However, what I was talking about is the physical being that we've seen walking around the ship, going for trips in the Maru, strolling around on planets, and all this other stuff. This is not a hologram, but is a physical body that (according to Ziyal) was built by Harper. Evidently, part or an entire copy of the Andromeda AI is stored in this body. A few episodes back (Spoilers), she (the organic/physical/yadda body) went with Dylan onto a planet and got trapped there. She still functioned and the ship still had a functional AI, but they were completely cut off from each other. In this newest episode, Dylan shuts down the Andromeda AI, yet the "body" was reactivated without the Andromeda AI being reactivated.

I think I understand it now. Whew!

Founder, president, CEO, CFO, COO, under-secretary general, mascot, and caterer of the APAO

Posted by BlueElectron (Member # 281) on :

yeah, well, Data is still better!

------------------
What is the difference between a terriorist and your girlfriend?
- With terrorist, there is a chance of negotiation.

Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :

Hmm... Let's take a look at that. Who would I rather be dating? Data or Rommie? Hmm...

Nope. Definitely has to be Rommie.

Founder, president, CEO, CFO, COO, under-secretary general, mascot, and caterer of the APAO

Posted by BlueElectron (Member # 281) on :

well, if you look at it that way, I guess that's the right answer.

But who do you want as a comrade in a battle?

------------------
What is the difference between a terriorist and your girlfriend?
- With terrorist, there is a chance of negotiation.

Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :

Mr. T

------------------
"I said 'You are, you are,
The only one who sees.'
I said, 'You are, you are'
The only strength I need.'"
---Kim Leaman, "Mary"

Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :

I've watched every ep of andrmeda so far, and I'm still not sure how the AI and the Avatar are tied together. The engineer, Haper, built the Droid in a very bad episode called "To Loose The Faithful Lighting". In that ep, the Avatar had full controll of the ships systems, inculding gravity controll, and used it to stop a group of children that were about to take over the ship. In this last ep, Rommie(The Avatar)seems to be more independent then it seemed early in the series. I know in one episode, where she a Dylan were thrown in prison, her batteries were running down. A reference was made that Harper could improve on her power supply so she could leave with her new boyfriend(also an Avatar), but one scene had Rommie argueing with her own holo image and another andromeda image on a screen, like each one has it's own personalty. Frankly, if the last two eps aren't a lot better then what I've seen so far, I wont be watching next season. I've only continued to watch because of Moding at Slipstrembbs.

------------------
yes, I'm very dutrnk at the moment, and i'm doing my type to best so shut up! JK

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

I'd rather have Rommie as a comrade in battle. Data's not a FRIKIN' big ship like Andromeda.

So far as I can tell, Andromeda copies herself to wherever she's needed (avatar, droid, screen, whatever), and when two copies interface, their memories merge. She's just a computer program. The avatar can, of course, control the ship, because she IS the ship.

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

Well, some new info, now that "Star-Crossed" has shown. Apparently, the Avatar can develop a seperate personality based upon experiences. It's a different copy of the same being. Like the whole Tom Riker thing.

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

I just want to know why Hunt ordered "HARD LEFT!" during combat.

Shouldn't he be ordering "HARD PORT!"?

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant
Average Rated 8.32 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux (with seven eps posted)
***
"Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!"
-Omega 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001
***
Card-Carrying Member of the Flare APAO
***
"I think this reason why girls don't do well on multiple choice tests goes all the way back to the Bible, all the way back to Genesis, Adam and Eve. God said, 'All right, Eve, multiple choice or multiple orgasms, what's it going to be?' We all know what was chosen" - Rush Limbaugh, Feb. 23, 1994.

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

Does it matter? They mean the same thing. And I doubt they're supposed to be speaking English (despite the common fallacy of making plays on words that wouldn't work except in English), so whatever non-English word he used could be translated back into English as either "port" or "left" and be the same...

------------------
Lister: "Drop dead, Rimmer."
Rimmer: "Already have done."
Lister: "Encore."
-Red Dwarf, "Kryten"

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Well, they don't mean the same thing.

Left is subjective. If Hunt is facing the back of the bridge, his left is the ship's right. The whole purpose of the port/starboard is so that when the captain yells an order at the helmsman, the helmsman doesn't have to shout: "Your left, or mine?!"

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

Unless they're all smart enough to realize that "left", in such a context, means "the ship's left". Otherwise, they might even have to ask "your port, or my port"?

------------------
Lister: "Drop dead, Rimmer."
Rimmer: "Already have done."
Lister: "Encore."
-Red Dwarf, "Kryten"

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

No, because port is the ship's left. Whether you're facing aft or fore, when someone yells, "HARD A PORT!", you know that they're talking about the ship's port. Port and starboard aren't interchangeable, like right and left are, depending on a person's orientation.

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

So, why isn't it valid to use "left" and "right" the same way, as long as everyone knows you're talking about the ship?

------------------
Lister: "Drop dead, Rimmer."
Rimmer: "Already have done."
Lister: "Encore."
-Red Dwarf, "Kryten"

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Too easy to get confused, I suppose.

Port & Starboard has been Naval tradition for centuries. Besides, what if something's blowing up on your left?

"JOHN! LOOK TO YOUR LEFT!"

::John turns to port::

"NO, JOHN! YOUR LEFT! YOUR LEFT!"

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

Well, then, they say "John! Look to Starboard!"

And remember, this takes place eight millenia in the future, and humanity was hardly the founding member of the Systems Commonwealth. Other species' traditions may have crept in. Not that we ever SEE any of these species...

Another thing: the Balance of Judgement was male. Huh? I mean, it was necessitated by the storyline, unless you want to make Rommie bisexual or something, but they specifically stated in a previous ep that ship avitars are supposed to be female, because Humans, Than, etc. all liked it that way. Was the ship originally crewed by some other, minor species that prefered male avitars? Or did the avitar self-rewrite once it went insane?

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Maybe the captain was gay ... ?

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

But when giving an order to steer the ship, or some such, it would be obvious that "left" or "right" means that of the ship.

I think you give the pilots' intelligence too little credit...

------------------
Quintesson 1: "It is a day so long in coming that I am uncertain how to celebrate it."
Quintesson 2: "Perhaps a quiet chuckle..."
Quintesson 1: "Very well, then. Let us... chuckle."
Quintessons: "Hehehehe..."
-The Transformers, "Five Faces of Darkness, part 3"

Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :

quote:

Another thing: the Balance of Judgement was male. Huh? I mean, it was necessitated by the storyline, unless you want to make Rommie bisexual or something, but they specifically stated in a previous ep that ship avitars are supposed to be female, because Humans, Than, etc. all liked it that way. Was the ship originally crewed by some other, minor species that prefered male avitars? Or did the avitar self-rewrite once it went insane?

I may be way off here, but it is my understanding that all the ships were designed by the Vedran. Centariods.

------------------
yes, I'm very dutrnk at the moment, and i'm doing my type to best so shut up! JK

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

You also have to consider that any maneuvering order might well be given directly to the ship verbally. Thus, "right" would be the right of the person executing the turn, because that's the ship.

Another possibility that's occured to me is that the Balance WAS female, but went through an identity crisis when her captain was killed. Or perhaps she chose to rewrite because she felt that a male presence was required to attract other restors. Either way, that avitar may have been a duplicate of the actual captain of the Balance of Judgement.

As for the Vedrans designing the ships, I don't think I'd heard that. Nor the bit about their being centauroid. Though it would make sense, given Harper's comment about the women having four legs...

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by BlueElectron (Member # 281) on :

mmmmmm....four legged woman.....

------------------
What is the difference between a terriorist and your girlfriend?
- With terrorist, there is a chance of negotiation.

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

quote:
I think you give the pilots' intelligence too little credit...

Dude, it's navy jargon. Are you saying the people stearing the submarines and aircraft carriers and battleships of the vast majority of the naval fleets of the world have low intelligence? Please, dude, try and think about what you type ...

Port & Starboard is used to refer to all ship's operations, whether a bunch of people are going to lower some life rafts or steer the ship, the orders given (in the US & British fleets), are Port & Starboard ... now, perhaps that's different in the future, but insulting the Naval officers and crew of the US and British fleets (and whomever else uses similar jargon -- which is, I imagine, all) is just really petty.

quote:
You also have to consider that any maneuvering order might well be given directly to the ship verbally. Thus, "right" would be the right of the person executing the turn, because that's the ship.

Now that is a good explanation! Except, a) why is there a helm if the ship steers itself? And, b) was Rommie even on the bridge?

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

"I think you give the pilots' intelligence too little credit..."
"Dude, it's navy jargon. Are you saying the people stearing the submarines and aircraft carriers and battleships of the vast majority of the naval fleets of the world have low intelligence? Please, dude, try and think about what you type ..."

Are you an idiot? I just said that they have more intelligence than you give them credit for! I'm not the one who needs to think before typing here...

And, as you say, it's navy jargon. On Earth. In English-speaking countries. Does Andromeda take place on Earth, w/ any connection to an English-speaking country? Not the last time I checked...

------------------
"Even the colors are pompous!"
-a friend of mine, looking at a Lexus brochure

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

Of course Rommie was on the bridge. She's ALWAYS on the bridge. And everywhere else, for that matter.

And the helm is required for slipstream maneuvering, because that requires an organic sentient. Which raises the question of how the "Balance" moved around with no crew...

The helm would also be useful if the AI ever went down, or if you wanted to execute maneuvers that couldn't be easily described verbally.

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

One could argue that Rommie is the bridge, even... :-)

------------------
"Even the colors are pompous!"
-a friend of mine, looking at a Lexus brochure

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

You know, I was half way expecting Dylan to try and pull a Kirk on the Balance. "Starships are the enemy! They must be destroyed!" "You are a starship. Execute your primary function." Instead, we get "You have met the enemy, and it is us." Come ON.

------------------
"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

Maybe the Enterprise computer is dumb enough to try to calculate pi to it's last decimal place, but I think the AIs on "Andromeda" are a little too smart to fall for that sort of thing. :-)

------------------
"Even the colors are pompous!"
-a friend of mine, looking at a Lexus brochure

Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :

quote:

And the helm is required for slipstream maneuvering, because that requires an organic sentient. Which raises the question of how the "Balance" moved around with no crew

In the Borg, wait, I mean "Consesces of parts" episode, they established that a machine with orgaic brain material can navigate the Slipstrem, although, I got the impresion that the Balance of Justice had a crew of Restors.

------------------
yes, I'm very dutrnk at the moment, and i'm doing my type to best so shut up! JK