It's on thie Friday, but promises to have a hell of a lot of bang for your hour following the setup mediocrity of "Crusade" (which was dull enough that I haven't written a review for it yet). I don't get Skiffy, so seeing these preview pics really raised some hairs:
-The new Daedalus-class (BC304) carriers USS Odyssey and Korolev, blasting away. And one may not survive...
-Lots of Ha'tak class motherships, which will undoubtedly end up as cannon fodder;
-The fancy new Orii warships in action! Jeebus, it rocks to have such an original design in SF again! They remind me a lot of the various ships and models from the 1980s "Dune" movie. They are also apparently inspired by the whatsit that the Doci guy was wearing in "Origin". And, kickass use of stargate-like rings as a power source.
-And last but not least, an O'Neil-class Asgard ship. Been a while since we've seen 'em, and it looks like the Asgard are getting into the action too.
-Naturally, the battle seems to be happening in open space...
Mark
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
"On second thought, let's not go to Camelot. It is a silly place." I had no idea that my little joke would be so spot-on. Not only did Arthur and Merlin go to Camelot, but Arthur also went out to search for the Holy Grail! I'm getting a flashback to two seasons ago, and the search for The Lost City�. Certainly should prove interesting, if slightly repetitive...
Concerning the destroyed ship, my guess is that the Korolev was destroyed � that's the one that Mitchell was on, and he was talking about scrambling the F-302's a few minutes before. So naturally, he managed to launch just in time, and poor Colonel Chekov just bought the farm. (That is, unless, the Asgard ship pulled a deus ex machina and beamed off whichever main characters were left on whichever ship was destroyed.)
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
That'd still leave Daniel unaccounted-for.
Those ships vaguely remind me of the Bentusi.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
I sure hope the episode is fifty minutes of wandering around a muddy ren faire and ten minutes of something interesting.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
quote:Originally posted by Omega: That'd still leave Daniel unaccounted-for.
Oh right, I forgot that both Daniel and Mitchell were on the Korolev. Okay, so that means that the Odyssey was the one that got destroyed, since no one important was on the ship. Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
I'm sure they won't do this, but I suddenly got this picture in my head. The four Ori ships are through, and the ubergate deactivates. They've destroyed most of the allied fleet. They survey the carnage, and prepare to go assimilate-- I mean, convert the galaxy. But then, Sam dials the gate and the kawoosh vaporizes them all.
It'd just be fun to see.
I think we know why bizarro-Sam seemed slightly traumatized by their failures against the Ori...
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
I guess Sam had better hope someone aboard the Odyssey mentioned to the Korolev that she was outside.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Well, I noticed that the SuperGate was continuing to stay open for many minutes after the Ori ships came through. My suspicion is that, based on Sam's comment about dialing out first, the SuperGate will be able to remain open indefinitely. It is, after all, powered by a black hole (on our end, and probably on theirs, too).
Posted by WizArtist II (Member # 1425) on :
Ok, so what was Vala doing on the Ori ships all urped? I have missed the last couple of episodes.
It still seems kinda cheap how the "good guy ships" get blown apart with NO consequences to the Ori ships. Of course, if they capture one of them, then they have the means to defeat the Wraith ships that are heading to Earth from Atlantis.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Vala convinced her Ori-follower husband to take her with him.
I think it would be amusing if the Wraith arrived in the Milky Way, only to prove a nuisance to the Ori which promptly wipe them out. Then, of course, the Ori would start sending Priors to Pegasus...
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
It's going to get to a point where we're going to have to spell out the history of the ancients in a single timeline. They did so much, over so long a span, that it doesn't all fall together easily. There were obviously multiple factions or groups of them, some ascended, some didn't, all at different times. My understanding was that the Ancients were preventing the Ori from knowing about the humans in our galaxy. Does the same apply to Pegasus? Just how far are the Ori spread? Just how far did the Ancients explore and spread, for that matter? Why were the Asgard active in our galaxy particularly, and not Pegasus? Spatial proximity? There are a lot of unanswered questions.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Minor notes:
-People are going to be arguing which of the two Daedalus-class ships were destroyed for months. It's already been revealed, but it's a season-premiere spoiler, so I won't reveal it here.
-Despite being an identical ship, Korolev orients its aft display like Prometheus did, and not like Daedalus or Odyssey do. Those wacky Russians, we give them the keys to a brand new starship and they start right off changing things around for no reason... They also changed the lightbulbs too!
-The O'Neil-class ship is seriously out of scale - it seems around the size of the Odyssey, but in fact should be much, much larger.
-While the making of the Alliance to fight the Ori should have taken much longer than spending most of the episode slogging through a medieval town, it DOES reveal who the major players are left in the galaxy. Earth, the Jaffa Nation, and the Lucian Alliance are obvious significant powers. Baal is the sole remaining System Lord of any consequence, and the Asgard are only peripherally involved though they understand the Ori threat. Who else is there? No one major, except for a few races here and there with really advanced technology. No real empires or multi-planetary governments left, eh? Well, things have been chaotic over the past two or three years (specifically with the Replicator invasion, which could conveniently wipe out any high-tech civilizations we haven't heard from in a while), so any other potential powers probably aren't that great.
Mark
Posted by WizArtist II (Member # 1425) on :
like maybe the A'shin? Or however it's supposed to be spelled?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Aschen.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
I'd say that the Aschen are quite busy with that list of addresses given to them. Especially if they dialed the black hole.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Dear Asgard: Please send a fleet, and not this one ship business, because remember how in early episodes you were all "We'd totally deal with the Goa'uld, but we're way busy," and it was neat to see an advanced alien species that was willing to use that advancement to help out the main characters, rather than being all SOME SECRETS MAN IS NOT READY FOR about it, like certain other aliens we could name? And now would be, you know, the perfect time to swoop in and look awesome. You could even lose, since the Ori have magic powers, so you wouldn't unbalance the story.
(The Asgard ship isn't shown taking a hit, is it?)
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
It is indeed shown taking a hit. Right around the time they show the Odyssey taking a hit, I believe.
And I think the only time we ever saw more than one Asgard ship in a battle was when the Replicator ship came to Orilla. Which may mean that for some reason they don't view the Ori as a big a threat as the Replicators. Of course, the Ori aren't in Orilla's galaxy, so they may just be viewing it as a human problem.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Or maybe, y'know, they got totally smote by the Replicators and don't have many ships left to spare?
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Naaaah. Couldn't happen.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Well, for some reason Thor hasn't been around. Kvasir noted that both he and Heimdall were attending to stuff in a different galaxy, so Kvasir had been taking their place. It's a little odd Thor hasn't shown up (Michael Shanks provides Thor's voice, so it's hardly a question of availabilty), but I guess a little variety is in order...
Mark
Posted by WizArtist II (Member # 1425) on :
There is also no telling how many Asgard are left. IIRC, they are reproducing at a very slow rate and using genetic cloning to keep the race alive. After the RepWars, their population could have been decimated. While I don't recall ever having seen more than one Asgard on any ship, who knows how many it takes to run an O'neall class, or how many are involved in reconstructing their planets and fleets.
Posted by cubby14 (Member # 1428) on :
I reckon it was the Korelev taken out. Also the BC-304 that we saw being hit only had the bow section being destroyed and not the stern. The bridge and F-302 bays are in the stern scetion including Mitchell and Daniel. I hope they actually built a fail safe into the BC-304 so that the stern can act as a life boat if the bow is gone and vice-versa.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"I reckon it was the Korelev taken out."
So, it's your contention that Daniel Jackson is now dead again?
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Well, it's that apparently only the front part is seen getting destroyed, and perhaps they are still alive in the wreckage. (Or such is my reading. Of the post, that is.)
Anyway, I remain unconvinced by the Asgard sympathizers.
Posted by cubby14 (Member # 1428) on :
Watch the last few moments of the episode again and you will notice that only the front section of the BC-304 explodes. I don't think Daniel is dead and neither is Mitchell or Checkov. Remember that Mitchell was heading for the F-302 bays when we saw the BC-304 get hit and the bridge is also in the stern of the ship. The fact that the Prometheus was split in half, I think they might have learned a lesson from that.
The Asgard have never really cared enough to send a big enough task force to defend our asses. Also the Asgard must be re-building after they got their own little butts kicked by the replicators.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Maybe the Asgard don't have the population to spare? Y'know due to the way they well don't exactly procreate.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
So I finally watch the season finale... and I've finally re-read this thread (sorry about my post above restating what was mentioned by someone else). I've now been spoiled too, to the end of the season of Atlantis.
Anyway - KICK ARSE EPISODE! Amazing. Everyone having their little bit to do.
I'm a bit over the who San Greal/Holy Grail thing after watching the Da Vinci Code etc. etc. at least they didn't say "It can also be read Sang Real" or something like that - although they did call it the blood stone.
Arthur is coming back? Presumably that girl in the village has the Ancient Gene but none of the men do? Maybe it's passed down in that village as an X-linked gene.
Amazing battle at the end. Pity the Asgard didn't do much at all - would have been interesting to see Baal swoop in too.
Or even a race from earlier on in the series that we didn't expect to see.
Teal'c shouldn't have been on a Jaffa ship - since their shield now seem to suck compared to the Asgard.
I'm guessing we see the destruction of the Odyssey - no more Vessir (or however you spell that smart-alec Asgard's name).
Stupid Doctor Lee last week draining the Ancient device of it's power.
It'd be nice if the Ori technology didn't look soo much like the Ancient technology - i.e. the control crystals.
How were they supposed to dial that supergate? Just plug in that crystal??
What DOES the ninth chevron on a stargate do??
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
quote:hat DOES the ninth chevron on a stargate do??
I think the ninth chevron's only used for making collect calls. Posted by Chris (Member # 71) on :
Well now that's an interesting idea. The receiving gate gets its power from the wormhole/sending gate, correct? Maybe using the ninth chevron makes it so the receiving gate powers the sending gate...
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
Nah. The 9th chevron is for changing the ringtone from "grindy-grindy chonk-chonk" to the theme tune to dallas.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Well, at least the "Dallas" tune is better than listening to the "Fruity Oaty Bars" jingle!
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Maybe the ninth chevron is what changed the wormhole effect to the Atlantis effect? Actually maybe that is what dialling Atlantis did!?! Upgraded the software.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
When does season 10 start back?
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
July something or other.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Or even a race from earlier on in the series that we didn't expect to see.
Furlings! I wanna see Furlings! Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Yes, and what the hell are the Nox doing? They could be helping to cloak ships and bring people back to life!
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Yes, and what the hell are the Nox doing? They could be helping to cloak ships and bring people back to life!
They're busy growing birds nests in their hair.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
quote:Originally posted by B.J.: Furlings! I wanna see Furlings!
Rumor has it we're going to see the Furlings in episode 200. Dunno if that's accurate or not....
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
NO ONE on the production staff of the show wants to see the Furlings. It hasn't even been mentioned in four years. The current show runners inherited it from the first season guys when they thought it would be cool - note that a LOT of stuff from the first three seasons haven't been seen since the changeover, including the Nox and Aris Boch.
Spoilers for episode 200 don't suggest that we will see the Furlings. At least, not the REAL Furlings...
Mark
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Okay, I can understand why they don't want to bring back the Nox again... but why would they have something against some faceless species that we know next to nothing about? They've been mentioned only twice for goodness' sakes!
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Thrice, at least.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
But it ads to the rich tapestry that is Stargate. It'd be nice to see that the Nox and the Furlings have some sort of role in the grand scheme of things.
I always thought that each of the "four races" had something different to offer... The Nox were more the healers - they did their work by hiding. They were clearly on Earth as they have influcenced Faerie mythology. It would be interesting if they had a tie in with the Arthur arc.
Andrew
P.S. Who are the two differen't "powers that be" between season 1-3 and 4-10?
Why ignore 60 hours of SG1??
How do you know so much about the production staff Mark - are you ON the production staff? You always seem to have little inside tid-bits.
Was Aris Boch that bounty hunter guy? I felt he was pretty much a one off.
It'd be interesting to see if the Tollana are REALLY wiped out? How they would also feel with Earth given superior technology - i.e. in the way of Goa'uld, Tok'ra, Asgard and Ancient technology?
What about the water creature from Fire and Water, y'know "Omoroca!!"
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Perhaps Mark practices that arcane, insiders-only art called watched the credits.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
NEVA!
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I know folks on the production staff, actors on the show, and I do indeed read credits and listen to the excellent DVD commentaries. Moreover, I also read the websites that publish way more tidbits than I can grope off of the other above parties.
The team changed betweeen seasons 3-4, mostly with the introduction of producers Joe Malozzi and Paul Mullie to the show, combined with the departure of show developer and creator Johnathan Glassner. Joe and Paul have been running the show since, with tha notable help of regular director/producers Martin Wood and Peter Deluise (yes, THAT Peter Deluise).
Between them and others, they've collectively moved SG-1 in their own direction since then. They've always been mindful of the mythology, but more of the anchor points than the texture, if you will. Plus, it's tough to refer to lots of story points that weree established ten years ago, to an audience whose main group has been with the show for only four.
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Is that true though - why is it hard to believe that people haven't been watching the show for the last ten years - I have. What changed four years ago? Plus people have DVDs.
I think the establishment in 'The Tourment of Tantalus' and 'The Fifth Race' was pretty big. Just because they haven't figured out a good way to introduce a race like, say the Furlings shouldn't mean they should ignore them. I'd rather see the Nox again or the Furlings over seeing the "Foothold" aliens or the Re-tu again.
The Nox must be up there with the Ancients though seeing as they could heal the dead and cloak massive cities. They could also do that neat trick that a few can do - where they open a gate without the need to dial. Who else could do that??
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Humans will be able to in a few years, and it's generally accepted that Apophis had a similar device in his posession for the premiere episodes.
You'll notice that they rarely use the wormhole effect anymore (and even then, it's the new one made for "Atlantis" with a bluer tint). The production team basically got sick of using the very same effect shot made for the movie in every single episode, so in the end it was "screw continuity" and use something new and different (and controllable by them). I won't speak for the writers, but I suspect that this sentiment also applied to a lot of the established aliens and mythology from the first few seasons.
You'll remember too that SG-1 started on Showtime, and when they made the move to Sci-Fi they suddenly became far more popular. There may have been certain legal reasons then that they had to abandon some older plot points too, due tot he change in distributors.
The original thought was that SG-1 would be sent to Skiffy to die in a year or two, but here we are four years later as one of that channel's almost popular shows, plus a spinoff.
Mark <--- Wanted to see Aris Boch again so much...
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
I could have done without the Aris Boch episode, personally.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Same here.
I mentioned a possible 'fix' for the reason we now see a different wormhole effect...
That when the SGC dialled the Pegasus Galaxy there was an update of the gate-network with new "software" from the Pegasus galaxy gates, which one might assume is more 'advanced' since It was presumably set up by the Ancients after the Milky Way network was set up.
Only problem - they left Atlantis and came back to Earth to basically either die or ascend or breed with the humans here. One might assume that that final dial out would have updated the network - BUT maybe it required a dial TO Atlantis to update the new 'software' - maybe it was set in place by Weir 'n' co 10,000 years before.
Just thinking - why would the Ancients put a pyramid + moon for the Earth Glyph? And same with Abydos... the pyramids are FAR older than even the Goa'uld?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
How about massively cloaked floating cities and healing the dead (remember the Goa'uld got the tech of the Ancients but it was corrupted - and corrupted the user if over used. Presumably the Ancients healing devices wouldn't do that - nor the Nox, themselves.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
quote:Just thinking - why would the Ancients put a pyramid + moon for the Earth Glyph? And same with Abydos... the pyramids are FAR older than even the Goa'uld?
Well, the Giza gate wasn't put there by the Ancients. They put the Antarctic gate there. When Ra rediscovered Earth after the Antarctic gate was lost, he put the Giza gate here. So that particular symbol being associated with Earth only goes back until then, I think.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
The other way around, sorta. Ra brought his own gate or used the one already there - either way, he created the mythology that the gate and all his technology were of his own creation, and that he was the one true God. When he was ousted from Earth and his gate buried, the other system lords brought their own in (or reactivated the existing one - this was never made especially clear) and operated it from the Antarctic until it was buried there in some natural disaster (remember some Jaffa were found frozen in the episode where they found the Beta gate).
This is how they explained the existence of various Earth cultures in the Galaxy that flourished after Ra's gate was supposedly buried - the other system lords used the second gate for millenia afterwards to port out cultures through the middle ages. When the second gate was also lost, by that time the human stock had been spread across the galaxy and no one realy cared anymore that the original planet was lost.
The Goa'uld were by that time the dominant race in the Galaxy, which persisted until Ra went and got a nuke to the face. Note however that since then almost the entire Galaxy has gotten itself modernised and secularized in only ten years! Tau'ri, you crazy folk...
Mark
PS - Aris Boch would SO kick your ass, ya pimpz.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I don't think that the System Lords were actually using the Antarctic gate all that much... remember that the Goa'uld didn't usually use ships that actually flew through the gate. And besides, hadn't the Goa'uld actually forgotten where Earth was, which was why they didn't bother us for such a long time?
From my understanding, Ra decided that the Tau'ri were already simply too much trouble at the time of the rebellion, which is why he just flew off instead of taking extraordinary means to suppress the uprising. If he already had any kind of real interstellar empire at that point, he would've ALREADY had a sufficient Human population to spread offworld, anyway. He just didn't anticipate that the Humans would actually develop such technology that could rival the Goa'uld.
My guess is that the few Jaffa discovered near the Antarctic gate were just some random poor schmucks who were sent to scout out what the Goa'uld thought was a barren ice planet. They wandered a bit too far and froze to death.
Concerning the point-of-origin symbol, remember that it wouldn't have mattered whether the Stargate was placed there by Ra, because the symbols would still have to be determined by the Gate network. Remember the whole "alpha gate"/"beta gate" issue from "Watergate" and that season one episode (whose name escapes me)? So the same symbols would've been used all along, regardless of whether the Gates were moved or inaccessible.
Posted by Chris (Member # 71) on :
Also, the whole notion that the gate symbols are letters in an alphabet gets interesting with the two POO symbols for Earth.
Posted by Chris (Member # 71) on :
Okay, I've been reading the current issue of the Stargate magazine here at work (yeah, its slow tonight) and something interesting caught my eye. In the section where they give updates on the cast and crew and filming and what not, the AD mentioned that they were filming in the bridge of the Odyssey.... So I think that's a good indication of which ship was blowed up.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Known this for months, man. What we DON'T know is just who survived from the one that didn't make it.
Gateworld.net. I like searching it for Stargate spoilers. It's like doing cocaine. Giant spinning rings of cocaine.
Mark
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Are you sure that the Odyssey wasn't the one hit? I thought it was blown in half, not completely destroyed. If that's the case, there's nothing preventing them from doing some Odyssey filming.
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