This is topic $$ Heroes 2x07 Out of Time $$ in forum General Sci-Fi at Flare Sci-Fi Forums.


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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Holy shit, we were right. Kensei is the killer. I really didn't believe it was actually true though, just fun speculation - holy, shit.

It amused me when Matt said "All I can do is read minds" - since when is reading minds "all" you can do? Got used to it pretty fast, huh? And now of course we have positive confirmation that Matt and his father's abilities are identical - that's a direct generation-to-generation power duplication.

I love how Claire's family took on the Butler last name... "Will Mr. Butler be joining us?" I get a kick out of that...I haven't heart my last name used on TV before, at least not that I can remember.

My TV's a bit temperamental; was the opening logo green instead of orange this time or was it acting up again? If so, why the sudden change?

When the swordsmith and his daughter were taken by Hiro out of the camp, he wasn't physically touching the swordsmith - so how did he teleport them both?

At least Morrie wasn't keeping Molly in a nightmare world, just sitting in an apartment - solitude is bad for your psyche, but 24/7 nightmare would pretty much be literal hell, and I don't think a small child could stand up to that. So at least Morrie, while pretty undeniably evil, isn't totally sick and sadistic.

And good for Matt, sticking it to his dad that way, and standing up for himself finally!

I *knew* Peter was going to accidentally leave Caitlin 'behind' (or is it leaving her ahead? ;P)...

And like I said - Claire was being really, really stupid. Now her family knows, and so does the Company. *high five* Right on, Claire, good for you.

Just like Suresh, I'm now not really sure who's good and who's bad either - Linderman's group WAS bad, and I thought that group was part of the Company, but maybe it wasn't; maybe there *was* a schism with Adam and Linderman and Petrelli against the rest, splitting off to form the group that would try to get Nathan to allow Peter to explode.

So, I'm glad we finally got a really good episode this season. And the preview of the next ep looks to be interesting too.
 

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Posted by Fabrux (Member # 71) on :
 
And he does it again. Maybe we should have a dedicated topic-starter for these?
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
Replying to something in the other, closed thread... Yes, the corona was green this week. Dunno why.

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Ummm, hmmm. My enthusiasm has once again caused me to infringe upon Most Holy Fabrux How about you start the threads related to new Heroes eps from now on, eh?
 

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Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
 
The logo is green this week (same with all the NBC affiliates) because of some environmental promotion they're doing. Meh.
 

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Posted by Fabrux (Member # 71) on :
 
Well I don't know about how holy I am... but okay.

I missed the first couple of minutes of the episode due to not finding it airing at its usual slot right away (a special 2-hour episode of Prison Break was on the usual channels...). Anything interesting happen directly after the recap, or was it straight to the disinfection bit?
 

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Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
 

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Originally posted by B.J.:
The logo is green this week (same with all the NBC affiliates) because of some environmental promotion they're doing. Meh.

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Did anyone else catch how quickly he healed from Peter's zap? Could Adam actually be the father of Linderman? I also have a hunch that the Kristen Bell character is related to him as well as the Petrelli's and Claire. Would also tie in with the tenuous Biblical reference of Adam and him being the First One?

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Reverend: 4 months. Thus, the title of 2x01: "Four Months Later."

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-he remembers being abducted and HRG's face, but nothing else. The Haitian worked for the Company then; what reason would he have to leave that with someone they're just going to dump back home?

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Parkman remembered the Haitian in the bar right before he was bagged and tagged. So perhaps the Haitian intentionally leaves scraps of memory as clues that something isn't right, giving them a fair chance to get paranoid enough to run, or maybe it's his form of secret rebellion against the company for making him do things he resents.
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
If you watched the preview for the next episode, you'll note it's going to show us how Adam and Peter met and became partners/friends.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
It looks like we're also going to learn how Peter got electro-powers from Elle. (Had they mentioned her name before?)
 

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Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
 
Why don't I take notice of spoilers warnings!?! Maybe in future people can leave a few gaps or warnings at the top of their posts!?! Thanks

Andrew
 

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Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
 
Nobody's mentioned Peter's sudden regaining of his memories. Does anyone else think we were seeing Angela's powers in action? Nobody in the past has regained their memories after being wiped by the Haitian(if we assume that's what caused Peter's amnesia) and it was curious that most of the flashes of memory we saw related to his mother, as though she was replacing the parts of his life that she was there to witness. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree, but that was the impression I got. It could have just as easily been the shock of seeing someone from his past life that jogged his memory.

Fantastic episode, anyway. I'm disappointed to learn about the green intro being a gimmicky network campaign rather than a cryptic hint about the plot, but I suppose either way it would have been a bit silly. The scenes with Parkman and Molly were my favourites too, but did anyone else find it hard not to smirk when Mo was telling Niki she had the virus and he had the big plaster over his nose?
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
I rather thought he was using Parkman's power without meaning to, and reading her mind. But I suppose it could have been her power; sort of an anti-Haitian. Wonder if she then could block his ability to block powers?
 

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Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
 
I looked at that scene again and you're right, he's reading her mind.

Y'see I thought she could control people's thoughts, this was backing up my theory. Towards the end of season one she was telling Nathan to let Peter explode and he was all "I can't do it, ma!", but then she put her hand on his back and he seemed to completely change his mind. For a while.

Oh well.
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Yeah, I'm hoping her power turns out to be really, really cool.
 

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Posted by HopefulNebula (Member # 1933) on :
 
It had goddamn well better be, the way they're cockteasing us.

(No, I did NOT just write "coketeasing.")

Also, I have to recant a bit about West being evil. I still think he's creepy and not entirely on the level, but I rewatched it earlier today and the company got the information on Claire from the police report, not the newspaper. That still doesn't make West entirely good/non-culpable in this.
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
I just think he's an ass. The sort of guy that, if Claire were one of my chick-friends in high school, I would have done my best to warn her away from. Of course, she's being a naive little twit herself, so...

I just want to see West, Claire, and Mohinder get a sharp, cold wake-up call, existential ice-water to the face, that it's a NASTY FUCKING WORLD they're involved with.

I wonder if Sylar will take Maya's power, and Peter will absorb Alejandro's ability and stop both Syalr and the Shanthi Virus...

--Jonah
 

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Posted by OverRon (Member # 2036) on :
 
Yeah I noticed the green intro and thought it was some hint or indicator about what was going to go on in the episode. Like I remember something similar from an X-files title sequence.

Anyways will Parkman and Nathan become company men?

As for Claire healing powers being the cure for the plague, I think that comapny will try and make a cure and fail. And that Sylar, after taking Maya's and Alejandro's powers, unwittingly being the one who cures the plague. I can see it now, Peter and Sylar will be doing battle in New York (I mean where else, as it does seem to be the center of Hereos universe). Peter then absorbs Maya's power from Sylar, and looses control of it, making Sylar's eye bleed that black liquid. Sylar then uses Alejandro's plague curing power to stop himself dieing, and in the process cures the Shanti virus plague. And of course, all the virus carriers will be nearby at the time and will be cured... Or something like that!

I like the twist of Kensai being Adam Monroe. Did he gather the original hereos together? Or did he find them after they'd done the "save the world" gig, like when they stopped the Typhoon destroying the Eastern Seaboard, and then subverted them into being the company we see in season 1? Which is another question, which came first the Company or the original band of Hereos?
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
The original band of heroes pretty much *is* the Company. The Twelve started the company; KensEi was not in the picture, so either he wasn't a part of the Company or...I dunno, maybe he was taking the picture!

I think it's bit early to speculate so wildly about the final episode of the season. And with this writer's strike, we might not even *see* the final episode of the season :-/ Anyway, speaking of Sylar, I keep wondering if Candace really died or just made Sylar think she did.

....Now here is some *wild* speculation that I don't actually believe is true....But wouldn't it be cool if in fact Maya, Alejandro, and Sylar are all together in that shack where Sylar was being kept, while Candace gives them the illusion of their merry trip to NYC with the aims of subverting Maya into a killer for use by the Company?
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
Couple things. Peter couldn't have been reading Mrs. Petrelli's memories. All the flashes were of her. Not him through her eyes.

If Adam's not in that picture then why did Nathan point out the people he knew and then point and say "but I don't know who this is" and have Bob name him?

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Adam wasn't in the photo when we saw it onscreen. As I recall the man Nathan didn't know was Maury - he asked Bob who he was, and Matt took the photo and did some dramatic walking-away-from-the-camera thing and said "that's my dad" or something like it.

Quote from the wiki page on The Company: " In "Four Months Later�", Kaito Nakamura reveals that there were twelve original members, and in "The Kindness of Strangers" a photo of the twelve is seen, with all members except Adam Monroe, who was the founder of the company. "

Also if you poke around wikipedia you might note that the writers call the symbol the "helix;" doesn't look much like a helix to me...

And here's a link from the actual Heroes wiki showing all twelve of the founders that were in the picture, none of which is Monroe: http://heroeswiki.com/Group_of_twelve

Edit: I've been looking through the graphics novels and I'll have to recant my earlier statement - the sadistic fuck Maury *was* keeping Molly in a nightmare world. Maybe he eventually quit the scary stuff, or here's an alternative idea... Matt said to Maury that this was HIS nightmare, his old apartment. So maybe when he got inside Molly's nightmare while sucking his dad in, he pulled her into Maury's nightmare himself.

[ November 08, 2007, 05:58 PM: Message edited by: Daniel Butler ]
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
Dan, I was talking about in this last episode when Nathan and Bob were talking about the people in the picture. Matt identified Maury a couple episodes ago. But either way, Adam's not in the picture so I need to see th eepisode again to see what I'm remembering...

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Oh, ok. Yeah, and perhaps me as well if I'm getting th episode order that confused.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"Also if you poke around wikipedia you might note that the writers call the symbol the 'helix;' doesn't look much like a helix to me..."

It looks very much like a very short segment of a helix, viewed from the side.
 

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Posted by HopefulNebula (Member # 1933) on :
 
I'm thinking Maury might not have been able to maintain the nightmare all the time, not while he was focussing on Niki. Maybe by "this is where he keeps me," Molly meant "when he's not terrorizing me?"
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
I know this is probably obvious to everyone else but it just *now* occurred to me...I was thinking about Alejandro and Maya, and how their powers are linked. I just thought that maybe since they're twins, the power got kind of ... split. The ability to create the virus went to Maya and the ability to turn it off went to Alejandro, and if they hadn't been twins - if there'd been only one of them - the person would have had the full ability to control it, both to activate and deactivate. What do you think?
 

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Posted by Fabrux (Member # 71) on :
 
IMO that would only work with identical twins coming from one zygote. Given that they're fraternal twins.... seems a bit of a stretch to me.
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
That's a good point, but then why do they both have powers at all? Granted we haven't seen any siblings of anyone else with powers yet (to my knowledge) so perhaps if two parents with powers have kids, all the children will have powers.

If we ever DO see a power/non-power pairing we can make a guess as to how dominant the genes are.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"Granted we haven't seen any siblings of anyone else with powers yet (to my knowledge)..."

Unless you count two of the main characters who have been on the show since the beginning.

Not to mention Hiro's sister, but there hasn't been any indication of whether she has powers or not.
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
Oh right. Them. I meant besides them, obviously. I mean, only an idiot would forget about that.
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
I wonder if both Jessica and Nikki had powers, or if that's just one ginormous clusterf***. Or if that's what happens when idential twins have powers.

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
 
I don't recall any mention of the "real" Jessica being her twin, just her sister (though I may be forgetting something.)
Though it is possible that she would have some form of power, at least.
I wondered about Hiro's sister as well, however, their Father's uncertainty if another Nakamura would "ascend" may indicate that, in his experience, children of the "gifted" don't always exhibit powers of their own.
Actually, now that I think about it, Kaito did say he didn't think Hiro would be the one to "ascend", which means he expected the sister, hence keeping her close while leaving Hiro in the cubicle farm to work his way to inherit the company.
Also, when he gives Clare over to Noah there seams to be some question as to whether or not she will also eventually have a power, despite her parentage.
 

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Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
 
You can also look at Mohinder. His sister had a power(or at least, it was very strongly implied), while he doesn't appear to. The idea that everyone who's born from a Hero gets powers just seems to me like wishful thinking from fans. I'm not very familiar with genetics, but siblings can have different coloured hair and eyes and other features, so it shouldn't be such a stretch that some have powers and some don't.

Then again there are some very strong lineages of family members with powers. Just think of Claire. She has a power, both her parents and grandparents have powers as well as her uncle. Maybe whether you get powers is dependent on whether one or both of your parents have them. If it's just the one, then there's less chance?
 

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Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
 
Yes, inherited genes can be recessive though obviously if both parents have a certain trait then the likelihood of it being passed onto the children is greater. Anyone who breeds pedigree animals can tell you that. Of course it's all subject to chance, so someone who is a 3rd generation "Hero" (at least) like Claire has a VERY high chance of developing powers, though there is a small chance the gene may be recessive in her. I'm sure a part of the long term reason the company kept her so close (aside from the obvious) is to see if her children would exhibit powers, even if she didn't.
 

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Posted by HopefulNebula (Member # 1933) on :
 
Yah, it's a series of 4 genetic markers. I can see how while they might be dominant, they're easily skippable. Everyone in my family (one side of it, anyway) has the same nose except me.

And it often seems that a person's power tends to relate to their personality or interests. The office drone who wants a way out of where he is can teleport, the nurse/nicest person in his family is an empath, the guy who can barely read because he's so dyslexic can at least read minds...
 

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Posted by Daniel Butler (Member # 1689) on :
 
That's an interesting take, I hadn't thought of the appropriateness of the powers. Perhaps the whole thing is a polygenetic mess linked to the genes for personality? Or perhaps its *magic*!!!!

Reverend, I think the specific line that Kaito said to Bennett when he handed Claire to him (well the subtitle translation of the Japanese anyway) was "If she manifests *blah blah*." So yeah, I don't think they were sure she would have a power.
 

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Posted by Bones McCoy (Member # 1480) on :
 
Well, as for Maya and Alejandro, we've seen how inexperienced mutants (yeah, I said it) have barely scratched the surface of their powers (Parkman, Peter, Hiro, for example). So I think Maya and Alejandro have the same power, but they use dfferent aspects of it... Maya being the 'fragile' (hardly) sibling, always needing protection, and Alejandro being the stronger one, always "right behind his little sister" if Memory serves. I think Sylar's gonna be in for a surprise when he finally gives Alejandro the chop. And it will be Alejandro to go first... Sylar would want to protect himself before taking on something that could kill him (after the Ted Sprague learning-curve, I mean.)
 

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Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
 
Good episode. What happens to the Irish chick? She's left in the future. Wouldn't Peter changing something in the past make her not get captured - but then that could stop them both from being captured then Peter wouldn't come back in time to change... what ever to stop them getting captured. "I hate temporal mechanics".

So the ability duplication seems to be the dominant sub-theory... Someone around here mentioned it after, like the first episode - which annoyed me because it was obvious - whoever did - had been reading extra stuff because it was NOT very obvious from the first episode.

Duplicates (or semiduplicated power)

Claire - Adam
West - Nathan
Matt - Maurie
Molly - Maurie?? (She said last season that someone else could track down mutants).
Candice (was that her name - the one who tried to stop Sylar escape and shot herself in the head to stop him from getting her power) - Angela Patrelli? Someone mentioned once that it seemed Angela Patrelli could have the power of suggestion

The chick who could change environments (she was really a fat chick) - Mauri

Micha's cousin - The cute girl from the diner (fast learning)

Micha - Hana Gitelman?? (Ability to talk/utilise machines/computers

Sylar/Peter Patrelli - the ability to take other's powers.

Hiro appears to be unique.
DL appears to be unique
Lindermann appears to be unique
Isaac Mendez appears to be unique.

I was wondering if Angela Patrelli's powers were the opposite to the Haitian - maybe putting memories back in?
 

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Posted by Bones McCoy (Member # 1480) on :
 
I'm thinking they're gonna use a scenario from X-Men here. The company wants Claire's healing powers. Presumably they want to infect her, and use her antibodies as a cure for the plague.

Just like when Apocalypse developed a doomsday virus and Cable travelled back in time and purposefully infected Wolverine to get a cure from his antibodies.

ok, that being said, I think I'll unplug for a while and maybe find a girl... I'm reading WAAAAY too much into my fantasy worlds...
 

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Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
 
Anyone note how there's only three episodes left until...I don't know what?Season Finale?
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
They're doing the same thing they did first season. Eleven episodes, break, eleven episodes.

Bones, it wasn't "reading ahead". I don't remember who posted it, and don't feel like going back to check, but he was quoting Tim Kring in an interview or other comment on the NBC web site where he said that we were going to see powers being duplicated this season.

Oh, and Andrew -- Candace was the fat chick. Eden was the manipulator.

--Jonah
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"They're doing the same thing they did first season. Eleven episodes, break, eleven episodes."

If the strike doesn't end soon, it's going to be eleven episodes, period.
 

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