I just fell over laughing reading this....
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
The next time I assemble a PC, I'll make sure to assign a black drive as master and a white one as slave. B)
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I'm really tempted not to believe this. The bloke saw a load of devices marked "master" and "slave"? Buh? Since when has anyone specified whether they want a master or slave drive when buying a hard disk?
Even if we're talking about pre-assembled computers, the number of them with two hard drives must surely be less than 1%.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
Well every drive has the labels on them - for pin-location.. but still !!!
This is rediculous...
So the color black will no longer be black - it will be SHADE or the Color Dark-Absense-of-light!
The shade of white will not be white anymore - it will be the color BRIGHT or Opposite-of-the-dark-absense-of-light !!
The color yellow won't be yellow anymore - because we don't wanna insult the asian community - so it will become the color Green-minus-blue!
C'MON PEOPLE WAKE UP!!! *shakes head*
When are people gonna stop equating everything to slavery -- In the industry - the drives are label correctly -- one is a master drive - which a motherboard sees and uses first as a system drive - the other is a slave - and by it's very definitions - these labels are correct... LIVE WITH IT ALREADY!!!! It has NOTHING TO DO WITH GODDAMNED SLAVERY IN THE 30'S 40'S AND 50'S AND 60'S FOR CRIPES SAKES... quit turning it into a some fricken political nonsense...
*fans self* ok.. i'm ok .. phew.. that's my vent...
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
And did anyone notice that the place where you plug the slave in is at the back of the bus?
Mark
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
It's this very kind of thing that made start filling in the "race" field on applcations and whatnot with the term "European American".
Never been to Europe. Have no idea when my ancestors came over. But I'll be damned if I'm not going to make a stink for being called white.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: I'm really tempted not to believe this. The bloke saw a load of devices marked "master" and "slave"? Buh? Since when has anyone specified whether they want a master or slave drive when buying a hard disk?
Even if we're talking about pre-assembled computers, the number of them with two hard drives must surely be less than 1%.
There are no words to describe the sheer stupidity of this. Don't you have better ways to spend your lives?
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
Yes, as equals with EQUAL hardware rights! Now is the time to rise from the dark and desolate valley of drive segregation to the sunlit path of interfacial justice! B)
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
What a prat is all I can say to that.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
I think I can almost see why the US still has death penalty....
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
NOW IS THE TIME!!
Sorry. Caught up in this King role a bit. B)
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
What a load of crap. This is pandering to the lowest of the low. I cannot belive that they caved in on this!
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups. Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Mucus: Tsk. I really should have checked there first, shouldn't I?
Still, er, aren't we all getting just a teensy weensy worked up over this? Does it really affect you one way or the other?
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
it begs the question: What's next PsyLiam..? at what point are people gonna stop crying foul because Crayola puts the word "Black" on one of its crayons ...
A woman here at work suggested I was being racist because I saw a jar of hot-pepper-sauce on the kitchen counter here at work - and it had chinese writing on it. I asked her what it said - and that the very suggestion that i THOUGHT that she could read it was racist..... That just cuz she looks asian - doesn't mean she knows how to read ALL of the asian languages... And how do i know she can read it? Maybe she couldn't.. and if she couldn't - then it could be viewed as racist! I asked.. Can you read it?? and she said yes... and i said... well then - how am I a racist.. Just tell me if you can or can't.. and if you can't.. then fine !!!!
But do you see? - where does it stop?
[ December 04, 2003, 12:48 PM: Message edited by: Alshrim Dax ]
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
quote: But do you see? - where does it stop?
It can't. It's gone too far and taken on a life of it's own. This is a part of American Culture now.
Thank you Lawyers.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
Yip.. well up here in Canada too -- it exists here too.. all this damn political correctness!
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Read the book The Language Police by Diane Ravitch. This kind of crap really has gotten completely out of hand.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Well, normally I'd say its a bit absurd. But in this case, whatever. I mean SATA drives are almost the same price as normal ATA drives, it won't take all that long for the ATA to simply be phased out. So it happens by default. *shrug*
Just checked. The cheapest SATA drive is exactly the same price as its same brand/same capacity counterpart at 110 CDN. Yep.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
I'm not suprised at all that this came out of L.A.
B.J.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
This didn't need to go any further than the supervisor calmly and rationally explaining to this person the way this technology operates. It's completely understandable that someone unfamiliar with this would take offense, but with sufficient explanation, any reasonable person would certainly have to realize that these terms merely refer to the nature of the relationship between these drives. Obviously slavery was a dark and terrible chapter in US history, and we are clearly still feeling the ramifications of that horrible injustice, but this incident simply has nothing to do with intentionally invoking that history. Our efforts and concerns would be far better spent battling those eggregrious incidents of real and malicious racism.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
"how do i know she can read it? Maybe she couldn't.. and if she couldn't - then it could be viewed as racist!"
Well, you could have said "can you read it?", rather than "What does it say?"
Still, the way I'd deal with people like that is, well, ignoring them.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Whenever I turn on my computer, the start up page says, "Welcome to Macintosh, you lousy Jap!" Or maybe I'm just imagining it.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Yours too! I am glad things haven't changed!
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
The funny thing is, my computer's "name" for network purposes is "Master"...but it's a Dell, so the box is black! So am I a racist or am I all for black power?
Posted by Da_bang80 (Member # 528) on :
Oh, boo hoo! Someone got offended by a hard-drive! Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :
Jason: "...but it's a Dell, so the box is black!"
I've got a Dell Dimension 8200, but it's not really black. It's more black/purple, like an eggplant. I wonder, is this good or bad?
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Well, it may be offensive to eggplants...
Posted by Austin Powers (Member # 250) on :
Fuck political correctness!
I think I'm going to relabel my hard drives. Instead of "slave" I will put a sticker "filthy Nigger-scum" there, and "master" will become "Arian"...
I think America is really going over the top in many ways:
quote: "But we are culturally sensitive and we have 90,000 employees," he said. "We have to take these things seriously."
Since when do employers give a damn about employees. Here you can be glad if you have a job. Start complaining about some crazy P.C. crap and be sure to find yourself on the street in no time. Planety of others waiting to take your former job.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
quote:Originally posted by Wraith: Well, it may be offensive to eggplants...
Re-name it on the network as Clifford Worley.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
"So am I a racist or am I all for black power?"
Neither. You just believe in affirmative action. B)
[ December 05, 2003, 08:41 AM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
Posted by Saltah'na (Member # 33) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: And did anyone notice that the place where you plug the slave in is at the back of the bus?
Mark
It depends. If you have two drives connected via Cable Select, then the drive at the end of the cable becomes the master, and the drive in the middle becomes the slave. Otherwise, if you explicitly label them as master and slave (like I do, dammit I'm a racist), then you can put them anywhere on the IDE bus.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
PsyLiam: Perhaps I should have asked what it said instead of Can you read this for me ... but wouldn't that be suggesting that she's an idiot because I have to make sure I say things 'just-so' to ensure she understands my TRUE meaning?!
I hate speaking in euphomisms! Waste of breath, time and energy!
and YES.. .Language police in Quebec is absolutely rediculous. Only in Quebec can you get a fine for not having a sign with big enough french words in it! God forbid there's any english speaking people in Quebec.. if there is... slap a $150 fine on them and pay our women to stay pregnant with the profits!!!
Oooh to be Canadian!
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:and YES.. .Language police in Quebec is absolutely rediculous. Only in Quebec can you get a fine for not having a sign with big enough french words in it! God forbid there's any english speaking people in Quebec.. if there is... slap a $150 fine on them and pay our women to stay pregnant with the profits!!!
Oooh to be Canadian!
Shouldn't you be posting in French first with a font 2x as big as the English post? Don't make me call the language police.
Posted by Tora Regina (Member # 53) on :
quote:I think I'm going to relabel my hard drives. Instead of "slave" I will put a sticker "filthy Nigger-scum" there, and "master" will become "Arian"...
Now who's overreacting?
quote:Perhaps I should have asked what it said instead of Can you read this for me ... but wouldn't that be suggesting that she's an idiot because I have to make sure I say things 'just-so' to ensure she understands my TRUE meaning?!
Think of it this way. When you see a phrase written in German, would you ask a random white person what it says? Yes, she did overreact by insinuating you're a racist, though I think she was reacting to racial ignorance rather than racism. People do quite commonly assume Asian people are all Chinese, though as a Chinese person myself I don't really have a reason to complain. Besides, I think if people assume something about me from my appearance it is more effective to politely point out their mistake rather than call them racist.
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
My wife is Irish. Sometimes people confuse her for English or Scottish with amusing results.
But she doesn't fly off the deep end and invoke the race card.
Though if someone called ME Scottish I'd be very angry. Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"But she doesn't fly off the deep end and invoke the race card."
I would hope not. White people in England, Scotland, and Ireland are all the same race. Unless you're using very specific definitions of "race".
"I'm not an Angle! I'm a Celt, you piece of shit!"
[ December 05, 2003, 03:24 PM: Message edited by: TSN ]
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
So would most people. Even the Scottish, but that's because they are always angry.
"Perhaps I should have asked what it said instead of Can you read this for me"
Er, no, that's the same thing. You are still assuming that she can read it because she looks Asian. And considering the number of ethnic minorities in todays society, it's not really polite to assume anything about anyone. You should have said, maybe, "Hey, I don't suppose you happen to know Chinese"? That would have been the most polite.
quote:Originally posted by Austin Powers: Here you can be glad if you have a job. Start complaining about some crazy P.C. crap and be sure to find yourself on the street in no time. Planety of others waiting to take your former job.
I'm sure people will be just aching to move to Germany now.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
If I was in Wal-Mart, wearing a blue shirt with white lettering on it, I'd probably get asked where the toilet paper is whether I worked at Wal-Mart or not.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
Yes, but you are sexy.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
When you see a phrase written in German, would you ask a random white person what it says?
If you were an Indian in India, perhaps you might.
People do quite commonly assume Asian people are all Chinese
Well, the majority ARE. What, 1.3 billion now?
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
The majority population of the world is Chinese if you look at it that way. But if a Martian landed and went up to YOU and said "Since the largest group on this world is Chinese, we demand you translate this Chinese language", would that make it all right? Or would you say, "Look you moron green-faced tentacle man, I'm from Tennessee" just as someone might say "Look you moron, I'm Korean not Chinese, not Japanese, not Vietnamese..."
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
But if a Martian landed and went up to YOU and said "Since the largest group on this world is Chinese, we demand you translate this Chinese language", would that make it all right?
No, it's be incredibly rude. Thankfully, that has nothing to do with the subject at hand. If a Martian came up to me and ASKED if I could read Chinese, I'd say no and think nothing more of it. Well, beyond the fact that there was a martian in front of me.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Well, it does, because Alshrim didn't ask if the girl could read Chinese, he asked what it said. Which is the subtle but important difference.
And, to use your own analogy, this wasn't a Chinese person in China. This was a Chinese person in the US, and if I was in the US, I wouldn't assume they knew Chinese, especially if they were speaking without a Chinese accent (which they might or might not have been, to be fair).
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
You missed the analogy. This is an American asking an Asian person in American if she could read Chinese. An Indian person in India might ask an American if he could read German. And he said "Can you read this for me?" which could just as easily be asking if she was capable, from what I'm reading.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Actually, according to the original post, he "asked her what it said".
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
But would you be offended if someone asked you to read German? I doubt it.
I had someone (a black man) complain "I discriminated against him" because I couldnt stop my printing presses to run his small order but I was able to take five minutes (while the presses were still running) to help an old (white) woman to fax her stuff. I was so mad, I could have belted that fuck. The guy smiled at me, called my corporate offices on his cell phone and told them I discriminated against him and then wanted me to run his order immeadeately anyway....all while I took a wnother woman's order (white) for 24 hours later because we were so busy. He didint tell corperate that part, though. As if by his calling corperate and playing the race card, he was entitled to preferential treatment. I told him what I could do his job in 24 hour at best. Still pisses me off though. I'm a tall white guy that shaves his head and I have a short cropped beard/goatee. To this guy, I must have looked racist, so he assumed that was why I couldnt do his job (my explanation notwithstanding). So, was I discriminated against because of his preconceptions?
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
People like that deliberately look to start something, nothing more. It's overcompensation for what they think still exists (and the sad truth is, it does).
[ December 06, 2003, 07:07 AM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
It does exist but jumping the gun and assuming you're always being slighted is hardly what Dr. King had in mind....
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
Why is it so offensive when people make assumptions about you based on the way you look or talk? I don't get it. That's how we work. You analyze with your senses and make assumptions about your environment. Some people are better at it than others.
Being a big stinky and fully-americanized kraut, if someone thought I was Irish or Swedish or Danish or Dutch, it wouldn't surprise me. Like, yeah, I'm a really big white dude with blue eyes and blonde hair. So it's kind of a gimme.
If a person of asian descent had difficulty distinguishing between the admittedly subtle variations in scandanavian heritage, I wouldn't be the slightest bit offended. I have difficulty with it at times myself. And so sometimes people don't know the differences between Danish wrtiting and German, and that's a totally natural mistake. Who's got time to be offended by that? How is it different if I have a tough time distinguishing Cambodians from Vietnamese?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
The assumption is the whole crux of the argument. Yeah, if I was in China, and saw a white person, I would take a stab that they are likely to be American, but I wouldn't go up to them and start chatting in English assuming that they could understand me.
In the same way, I have Indian friends, but I wouldn't assume that they could read, say, punjabi. I would ask. Because, at the end of the day, it's polite.
quote: I was so mad, I could have belted that fuck.
As Diane said, don't you think you are overreacting just a tad?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by Omega: You missed the analogy. This is an American asking an Asian person in American if she could read Chinese. An Indian person in India might ask an American if he could read German.
And that analogy doesn't work, because on the one hand you're talking about a person of a certain race in a country, and the other hand a person from a country being in another country.
Anyway, assuming that you weren't being casually racist (Asian people aren't proper American like wot we are!), and assuming you meant "white person" instead of "American" in the final part, is still doesn't work. Looking at the relative racial make-ups of both countries, a white person in India is far less likely to be Indian than a Chinese person in the US.
And in any case, there's a far clearer delimination of lines amoungst Far Eastern races. Chinese people look far more different from Japanese people than Americans do from Germans. Apart from the weight, obviously.
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
We hired a woman here couple weeks ago. She had the oddest skin coloring. You know that color coffee turns when you add one of those little creamer things? That color.
Now, we don't track our workers according to race or anything like that (even though it is legal to do so because we run government contracts...) Couldn't just come out and ask her because it would have caused a backlash.
Then again I don't know that it would have... I just didn't want to take that chance.
Long story short, one of the other workers asked her and she's a mix of black/chineese/native american.
Kind of cool to find out her background, but I wish it was easier to just ASK people these things without fear of being blasted.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Chinese people look far more different from Japanese people than Americans do from Germans."
That doesn't really say much, since the Americans in question might be German (or, rather, of German descent). An American could be of any number of racial sub-categories (and probably a mix). If you're gogin to compare sub-sets of white people, it would probably be better to use Germanics, Mediterraneans, Slavics, etc. Or something like that. I don't really know where the lines are drawn.
And, anyway, I can't tell the difference between different types of East Asians. But, then, I can't tell the difference between different types of Europeans, either.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: The assumption is the whole crux of the argument. Yeah, if I was in China, and saw a white person, I would take a stab that they are likely to be American, but I wouldn't go up to them and start chatting in English assuming that they could understand me.
Happens all the time here in Tokyo. All non-Asians are assumed to speak English. Even non-European non-Asians are assumed to speak English. It's the best guess, since English is the world's lingua franca, and most international business people and tourists (as opposed to economic refugees) here do speak English. The largest exception are Chinese and Korean tourists.
About 15 years ago, when foreigners were relatively rare here, school children would routinely yell "hello, hello!" at any non-Asian person to try out their English. Drunken salarymen will still do this.
On the other hand, whites are usually assumed first to be Americans, then English. Scots, Australians, Germans, Frenchmen, and especially Canadians and Frenchmen spend most of their time feeling indignated.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: And in any case, there's a far clearer delimination of lines amoungst Far Eastern races. Chinese people look far more different from Japanese people than Americans do from Germans. Apart from the weight, obviously.
The Japanese pride themselves on being able to discern fine differences in quality between various consumer items, types of rice, and quality of cloth etc.. This discernment also extends to races and the belief that Japanese can infallibly tell by face alone who is "really Japanese" and who is a Chinese, Singaporean, or Korean "passing" as Japanese. The fact is, populations in all these countries have a great deal of overlap in appearance, due to ancient and more recent immigration as well as having all descended from the Chinese. So, while we can probably agree what a "typical"Japanese (or Chinese or Korean) face looks like, many native Japanese look like Koreans and Chinese (and vice versa). Furthermore, the standards of beauty or handsomeness in each country change considerably over the years such that a person considered ideally Japanese from the 1920s would now be considered to look somewhat Chinese.
I find that clothing, walking style, haircuts, and gestures are more reliable means of picking out non-Japanese tourists than is facial appearance alone.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: I was so mad, I could have belted that fuckAs Diane said, don't you think you are overreacting just a tad?
I was'nt mad because he thought ill of me, but I was pissed that he assumed he could call corperate and get preferential treatment over other customers by making a stink....his smug attitude after he called corperate was what made me mad. I couldnt have stopped the orders I was running for anyone: it would have caused us to miss an imporntant deadline.
Annnnnyway, Maso, I it's intresting that you see diffrences in how people walk. The only real diffrence I've noticed between cultures is the volume they speak in: that tends to vary wildly between what is socially acceptable in diffrent cultures.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
There's a black guy in the UK who's now been banned from taking out any more discrimination cases because he's taken out about 70 of them. Every time he was turned down for a job he would take a case to court claiming he hadn't got the job because he was black. Even when the successful candidate was black. Now that's overreacting.
Interestingly, last time I was in the US most people seemed to think I was Australian. I didn't mind but you would've though that Americans would know a British accent, bearing in mind the number of Brits in the US media (well, Blair and Hugh Grant at any rate). And it's not like the two accents are similar.
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
People need to take a deep breath, think and CALM DOWN.
Enough already! Lawsuits for this, that and the other thing too. Phhhha.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"And it's not like the two accents are similar."
To you, perhaps. But some British and Australian accents are similar enough to each other (when compared to American accents) that an American who doesn't know or care about the difference (i.e. most) couldn't tell.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN:
"And it's not like the two accents are similar."
To you, perhaps. But some British and Australian accents are similar enough to each other (when compared to American accents) that an American who doesn't know or care about the difference (i.e. most) couldn't tell.
Australlian is just British with a "island prison" twist. Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
Which isn't even getting into the whole Irish, Scotish, Welch, Cockney, Liverpool, etc. thing.
I myself find that at times Ihave a difficult time discerning a Kiwi accent from an Australian one. I find in these instances, it's better to guess the smaller country (see Norway vs. Sweden).
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I was thrown for a loop when I met my first South African girl.
....of course, it might have just been the girl in question. Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:Which isn't even getting into the whole Irish, Scotish, Welch, Cockney, Liverpool, etc. thing.
Yes I find it amazing that on that tiny little set of islands there are so many accents. In Canada anything west of Quebec and you can't really tell where we are from.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
? You mean aside from the fact that more than 95% of us are from Europe, Asia, Africa, etc. and pretty much everything but native American?
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:You mean aside from the fact that more than 95% of us are from Europe, Asia, Africa, etc. and pretty much everything but native American?
Well about 95% of the people I know are from Canada, your ethnic background very seldom shows in your voice past the second generation. My wife is Scottish and she doesn't have an accent, she just sounds like the rest of us, unless she is in a room with a bunch of Scots then the accent suddenly re-appears. I can assure you that I am a native Canadian, I was born here, my father was born here, his father and his father before him, gets kinda murky after that. How many generations does it take for you not to be European anymore?
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
"Past the second generation"
Well, thats convenient because according to Statscan , first and second generation immigrants alone account for 40% of the population in a sample of those 15 or older.
But on a more pragmatic level, I'm just saying from my experiences in Canada, its not all that difficult to tell which continent an average citizen is from, even by voice only. Especially for profs and TAs.
And the real question (leaving out genetics, because thats kind of murky) isn't how many generations your lineage has spent in Canada, its how many generations they've spent in various areas getting here from Africa Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by Balaam Xumucane: Which isn't even getting into the whole Irish, Scotish, Welch, Cockney, Liverpool, etc. thing.
Welch? I'm not sure if that was a typo or not, but it's amusing. I must use that at Welsh people.
I'm not sure about this, but the UK, and specifically England seems to be unique in coming up with strange names for it's accents. Scouse, Cockney, Brummie, Geordie, Manc, and so forth. And yeah, the last one is pretty easy to guess.
quote:Originally posted by Grokca: your ethnic background very seldom shows in your voice past the second generation.
Er, accents aren't genetic, y'know. Accents are picked up from listening to other people. For some people, they get their accent from their parents (or those they learn to talk around), and never change. Others change their accents if they move. Jane Leaves (Daphne from Frasier) now has a strange Manchester/Cockney/American hybrid accent when she talks, whereas Patrick Stewart still has that Royal Shakespear Company pronounciation.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by Grokca: How many generations does it take for you not to be European anymore?
Until you've been born in another country. Unless you are American, of course, because they seem to take pride in declaring themselves to be anything other than "American".
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
I'm me. Screw adjectives.
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:I'm me.Screw adjectives.
You need a girlfriend.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
If i go to the states - Americans AUTOMATICALLY peg me as Canadian! And I don't even say "Eh!" !!!!
And it's not ABOOT --- it's about!
Never knew there was a 'canadian' accent. But i suppose there is... and it was really hilarious when i was in Rocky Mount NC. last year - the bartender at one of the bar my buddy and I stop in at, said, "Y'all are from Canadian, aren't ya?!"
and I said, "Yip - how can you tell?" "Yall have a canadian accent, EH!"
I laughed, and said, "Have you heard me use that ONCE since I've sat at the bar..?"
D'uh.. NOPE... It's everywhere i tell ya.. but.. mostly, I find it comical.. so i suppose we canadians can be pegged by how we speak as well!
Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :
When I hear the word "canadian" I always think of Frank Drebin and BANG! my faculties get swamped by "Naked Gun" quotes and then I'm out of commission for a few minutes.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
*sigh* It's bullying writ large. That's all the present "PC" (that's Politically Correct, not Personal Computer) trend is a reflection of. Someone gets all noisy about something unimportant, and the target of that ire meekly submits. It's the schoolyard bully saying "give me your lunch money, shrimp!"
It's also an extension of the gang mentality. If you have nothing of value, you assign value to what you have. And it will persist until "us and them" no longer matter. For instance... I am proud (usually) to be an American. I am proud to be from Seattle. I am proud to be (among other things) Irish. I'm not attached to any of it. I don't get pissed off at someone saying "Yank". If someone says something disparaging about the Irish, I don't pull out a gun and scream that I'll bust a cap in yo disrespectin' ass.
The only reason PC has the power it does is because of people who get off on being victims. I've had variations on this conversation before -- too often for my taste. "Is it because I'm black?" "Actually, no -- I wouldn't have cared if you hadn't pointed it out." And like that. I know cops who are annoyed by the same thing, but I think it was summed up best in one of Robert Parker's "Spenser" novels:
"You arrest a guy with a rap sheet three and a half yards long, and people say 'is it because he's black?' No, it's because he's got a rap sheet three and a half fucking yards long full of similar crimes."
I'm flying up to Seattle in a few days to spend Christmas with my family. I will have to either leave my Swiss Army Knife at home or pack it in my checked baggage, whereas pre-9/11 I could carry it on my belt without a hiccup, so long as I passed it around the metal detector. I'm going to have to take off my shoes and put them through the x-ray machine. If anyone were seeing me off, they can no longer accompany me all the way to the gate. All this security because they don't want to be sued for profiling. Never mind the fact that it's been almost entirely Middle Eastern males between the ages of 15 and 45 who've been doing this stuff. Never mind that almost nothing can defend against the lone assassin committed to exhanging his life for the target. If it weren't for the fact that I actually want to get on my airplane, I'd raise a stink about just that. You know, here take my shoelaces, since I can strangle somebody with them. My belt, too, since it's got that heavy brass buckle on it. And my pen -- I could stab somebody with that. And come to think of it, better cut my hands off at the wrists because I'm trained in several forms of unarmed combat, and know how to kill with my bare hands.
*sigh*
--Jonah
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
But if they cut your hands off at the wrists, you'd still have two perfectly good bones to poke someone's eyes out with.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Sorry, but I just read that and thought. . .
Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: Sure, Brain, but if they cut your hands off at the wrists, you'd still have two perfectly good bones to poke someone's eyes out with.
The most annoying thing about the security I've encountered is the fact that if I want to get a meal, between clearing passport check and the metal detectors, and getting on the plane, if I go to a restaurant in the Duty-Free area I now have to eat with plastic cutlery. When it's six in the morning and I have to hack away at a suasage with a plastic serrated knife slightly less sharp than your average comb, I feel vexed.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
You could always use your comb.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
I don't own one. Or a brush. Just smooth my hair down after I dry it. But Kate's hair brushes (she has about a half-dozen, we keep forgetting one when we go on trips so have to buy another) - the bristles on those are fucking lethal. I could hijack an airliner with one of those.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Bearing in mind the average quality of airline food, you could probably use that to hijack the plane.
"I've got what is alledgedly a piece of fried chicken, and I'm not afraid to use it!!"
Actually, I find nothing wrong with the airline food I tasted over the years. Especially the Dom Perignon champagne...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
As to the PC story from Wraith:
quote: The prison officer was told to be quiet after three Asian visitors to the prison were spotted standing nearby, the Norwich hearing was told.
Why would anyone in their right fucking mind want to visit a prison?!? I was on the "scared straight" tour twice and it sure was'nt by choice. Mabye they just enjoy the overpowering smell of human excrement?
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
As i read that article, i am sitting here wondering 1) why is he throwing keys down a chute! 2) How does throwing keys at an 'imaginary' picture of Bin-Laden insulting to an Asian person - Let alone a British Assistant Governor. 3) Are these people on crack!? 4) whoever wrote the article isn't that great a writer... cuz i didn't understand the damned thing... he didn't explain why a prison guard would toss his keys down a chute!
Ok .. the last point doesn't REALLY count...
Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :
Answer to all 4 points and end comment: It's the thought that counts.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
Phew - Thanks for clearing that up, Nim! hahaha! Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
for those of you that use Office 2003 - it's Shift ` or the ~ symbol in that font.
Some forget that the swastika wasn't always a Nazi symbol.
Personally - wouldn't get all offended if i found that.. who knows.. Some kids could be doing a paper on the Second World War - and could use that symbol as part of his paper...
I dunno.. Does anyone here actually feel OFFENDED by this ??
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
Just so that we are comparing apples to apples:
quote:A form of the swastika has been used in the Buddhist religion to symbolize the feet or footprints of the Buddha.
We have a lil chinese guy here that works with us in my company - and he is buddhist! He suggests that the Nazi Swastika and the buddhist symbol are different, in the sense that the orientation of the Nazi Swastika is inverted!
It's like Hitler saw the buddhist symbol and used a mirror image for his own symbol. It has sparked quite a debate here at work. Our company deals alot with fonts and unicode and how they transcode into SVG and SVG-t -- so!! We all find it very interesting.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
It's a pretty common symbol actually: the Navajo used one (but theirs was mirrored so the "arms" leaned left). The swastika itself was a old good fortune symbol.
Could've been worse: Hitler couls have used a clover. Stick that in your Lucky Charms and eat it!
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
"Some forget that the swastika wasn't always a Nazi symbol.
Personally - wouldn't get all offended if i found that.."
If you had witnessed the horrors of WW2 firsthand, I think you would. Try to understand how laden that symbol is and what it still represents to a lot of people before you shove this on the PC pile too.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
It's more the intent that's NOT there that makes it silly. Just change the command in future versions and avoid any issues.
Just as a Pentagram or an inverted cross have diffrent meanings to diffrent people, some symbols, once associated with evil become irrevocably tainted in our collective view.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"...and what it still represents to a lot of people..."
So, what it represents to one large group (people who think of it as a Nazi symbol) is more important than what it represents to another large group (people who think of it as a religious/spiritual symbol)?
I would like to know whether the swastikas in the font were clockwise or counter-/anti-clockwise, and whether the arms are horizontal/vertical or diagonal.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
"Just as a Pentagram or an inverted cross have diffrent meanings to diffrent people, some symbols, once associated with evil become irrevocably tainted in our collective view."
Yeah, but the difference is that there are still people alive today (like my grandparents) who got a real close look at those evils when the swastikas were being brandished openly. That's not something you erase overnight.
"So, what it represents to one large group (people who think of it as a Nazi symbol) is more important than what it represents to another large group (people who think of it as a religious/spiritual symbol)?"
More important? No. More sensitive? Yes. You want to read PCness into that, be my guest.
[ December 12, 2003, 03:51 PM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
Symbols don't kill people, people kill people.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
quote:TSN SAID: I would like to know whether the swastikas in the font were clockwise or counter-/anti-clockwise, and whether the arms are horizontal/vertical or diagonal.
Actually, I can answer that. I have Office 2003, and the orientation was indeed, clockwise - however, the feet of the swastika were at the poles ... north, south, east and west, rather than squared as in the Nazi symbol.
The buddhist symbol - is INVERTED, as in, anti-clockwise - My chinese friend showed it to me in one of his buddhist texts!
As for whether or not i was at wwII is not relevant here. I am still sensitive to what occured to the jews - and disgusted with the things that Hitler did..
We have to remember that it would be like someone taking the symbol of the cross and using it as their flags totem - and that leader causing millions of deaths... but later condemning the cross because of that one man's vision - and forgetting the religious symbolism that it represents...
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
The point I'm making must be getting lost in cyberspace, because it sure as hell isn't coming across here.
Recap: I'm NOT saying the swastika should be purged from human history, I'm saying that for some people (namely those who were around between '33 and '45 and still are TODAY) the things it stood for during that period hit MUCH closer to home than whatever other denotations the symbol may or may not have do for the spiritual among us, capiche? Everybody on the same page now? THANK YOU.
Posted by Alshrim Dax (Member # 258) on :
Ok.. I see yer point - and i agree with you! Granted, there is a degree of sensitivity involved here - NO DOUBT! But at the same time, (devil's advocate) i don't think it should be removed from a font list because of it...
I will add here - as an asside .. that the Letter "I" was the Star of David in the same font!
Do we remove that too?
Again - i'm not being argumentitive... just interested in the opinions.. i find it an interesting debate.
Cheers...
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
No, neither should be removed, and yes, a line obviously has to be drawn somewhere, but I do think the swastika's darker associations are still too fresh in people's minds to treat it like any other symbol just yet.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
How would you propose we treat it differently from other symbols?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"The buddhist symbol - is INVERTED, as in, anti-clockwise..."
I may be misinformed, but I believe that, historically, the swastika has been used in both forms (probably meaning different things to different groups). The Nazis, I think, used only the clockwise version. Also, while the diagonal version is probably the most widely associated with them, they also used the vertical/horizontal version. I don't know if other groups ever used it diagonally.
"...it would be like someone taking the symbol of the cross and using it as their flags totem - and that leader causing millions of deaths..."
Like the popes, you mean?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Actually, this swastika thing has come up before. There was a Pokemon card released in Japan that had the buddhist symbol used as a background for one of the characters. When it was imported to the west, the image was flipped (as is common when translating Japanese stuff to English. It wasn't necessary in this case, but they were probably just doing it for every image). Anyway, on the US card, the background image ended up showing, yes, the Nazy swastika. And this was used by various religious groups to show how Pokemon was turning kids into Satanists, by, er, promoting Nazism. Or something.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Slightly off topic: Out of curiosity, why do they flip images when translating from Japanese to English?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I think it's a holdover from manga. Japanese is read right to left, so when comics are converted from Japanese to English, the pages are flipped, so that they read in a way that is easily understandable for Westerners. At some point, the people doing the cards must have gotten it into their heads to do it for them as well.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cartman: No, neither should be removed, and yes, a line obviously has to be drawn somewhere, but I do think the swastika's darker associations are still too fresh in people's minds to treat it like any other symbol just yet.
I agree the memory is far too fresh to become an arbatrary shape, but the time will hopefully come when we view the Nazis with the same kind of "Humans were so dumb back then" attitude that we do the Inquisition.
Of course, my own family lost many members to both groups of fanatics. We dont relocate well or something, I guess.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Japanese is read right to left..."
As far as I can tell, that isn't universally true. Apparently, it was written right-left before WW2, and now it's written both ways. If that's true, then I would think that some, if not all, Japanese comics would be left-right, and therefore inverting them would be unnecessary. So I wouldn't think they would just automatically invert everything that comes out of Japan.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I just look at the pictures in Japanese magazines. Usually they involve women dressed as schoolgirls.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
How would you propose we treat it differently from other symbols?
quote:Try to understand how laden that symbol is...
...the time will hopefully come when we view the Nazis with the same kind of "Humans were so dumb back then" attitude that we do the Inquisition.
If history and current events are any indication, not this century.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
quote: Unlike the traditional swastika, the Nazi swastika is almost invariably depicted at 45� to the horizontal. Two versions of the Nazi swastika commonly occur, one with outer bars pointed counter-clockwise, and the mirror image with outer bars pointed clockwise. Although the Nazis do not appear to have made a symbological distinction between the two, the latter is more common in their usage.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: If that's true, then I would think that some, if not all, Japanese comics would be left-right, and therefore inverting them would be unnecessary.
You would think wrong.
And actually, as a useless aside, VIZ are not starting to not flip certain Japanese manga when translating them, notably Dragonball. Partly because lots of manga artists think that the flipping process exposes flaws in the original image, and partly because they have to redraw any writing that appears.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
"Starting"? They've been doing that at least since '98.
I just wish Dark Horse has released a non-flipped version of the Star Wars manga. It was kind of painful seeing the Falcon "backwards" in every frame.
--Jonah
Posted by Ritten (Member # 417) on :
That article is the stupidest thing I have read in a long time....
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