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$$ Consequences of the movie on the original Trek universe [Spoilers]
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Guardian 2000: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Guardian 2000: [qb]1. Romulans from the Prime timeline have had ridges since at least the 2100s. (And tattoos have never been observed as a Romulan normal trait, even among the civilians.) Nero and the gang do not have ridges. Ergo they are not our Romulans.[/qb][/QUOTE]Not in TOS they didn't,[/QUOTE]You sure? There are exceptions, but most of the Romulans in TOS had helmets which featured the same forehead design. And no such Romulans have been seen in the 24th Century. Are you suggesting the unlikely scenario that this just so happens to be a ship totally staffed by a minority of smooth-headed Romulans? Do you have any evidence for this unlikely situation? [QUOTE] [QUOTE][b]Even in the Supernova timeline, they give stardates just like they do in BH 2233, a modified timeline.[/QUOTE][/b] So at some point between 2379 and the 2380s they went back to an older system of stardates. We've already seen them change dating conventions twice before.[/QUOTE]We've only seen one change of stardate schemes in 200+ years of Federation history. The Earth Starfleet used Earth-normal dating conventions. But again, your argument hinges on the argumentum ad ignorantium . . . specifically in this case, that no matter what changes are evident, they are based on a change that occurred between 2379 and 2387, no matter how unlikely. Case in point: [QUOTE]We have no idea what Scotty did or didn't do after we last saw him in "Relics" (TNG).[/QUOTE]See? I mean, I could point out other things, like there being no precedent for the Jellyfish design. But then you could simply say that we don't have any idea what super-advanced starship design techniques might be discovered 2379-2387. We quickly wind up with [URL=http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/Dragon.htm]Sagan's Dragon[/URL]. There's simply too much that is too different and would've been too easy to make [i]not[/i] different, and no reason to jump all 100 hoops to get to it. [QUOTE]No, it would have changed when he [i]came out[/i], which according to Spock was "minutes" later.[/QUOTE]I do not remember that line. However, I would've thought that going into the black hole in SN 2387 and coming out in BH 2233 would be simultaneous. After all, minutes spent in time travel have no real meaning when you get down to it. The point, however, is that unless Nero was not yet gone, thereby 'holding open the door', as it were, then the timeline should've changed immediately. We know from the film that Nero had already arrived at BH 2233 subjectively before Spock's entrance into the black hole in SN 2387. [QUOTE]Besides, they aren't using the "one timeline" theory any more, but rather the "many timelines" theory. For all we know, all our previous observations about how time travel works have been wrong.[/QUOTE]Our observations are not wrong. Our conclusions might be, but not because the producers have ignored the Trek time travel principles standard to the productions for 40 years. That simply means that, if we choose to care enough to try to make a cohesive whole out of it, we have to get more creative with our conclusions. [QUOTE]Originally posted by AndrewR: [qb]These were mining ship Romulans. [/qb][/QUOTE]We saw what appeared to be an average street corner of Romulus and a smattering of Romulans from the highest offices to the lowest underdwellers. I might be willing to go so far as to entertain the idea of a declining population of smoothheads over the 200 years of observed Trek until they were super-rare in TNG time, but barely . . . however, the concept of a specific caste of smoothheads is unprecedented and makes Occam twitch. [QUOTE]how many people are now gonna think that the Prime Timeline/Universe is gone forever!?![/QUOTE]I think the Supernova timeline is gone. However, I also see the new movie as a parallel universe altogether . . . an alternate reality, like Uhura said. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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