Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343
posted
quote:Originally posted by MinutiaeMan: As you yourself said, that '79 thing was only for a hostage rescue, not a full-out anti-government operation. Unfortunately, people like Rumsfeld are probably thinking that their Mighty Republican Power is unstoppable. I wouldn't be surprised if they thought that it was a good idea to try the direct and undiplomatic route again...
Just a point of clarifcation. Who was Carter's SecDef? The man who reinstituted the B-1B program....Donald Rumsfeld.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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quote:Putting aside any other questions of justification or wisdom, the best time to invade Iran would be before they finish building their alleged nuclear weapons.
Would these be the same kinds of nuclear weapons that we know Iraq was working on? If so, I'd suggest that the CIA guys start working on a way to counteract those cloaking devices before they start advocating an invasion of another country...
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
Registered: Nov 2000
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Putting aside any other questions of justification or wisdom, the best time to invade Iran would be before they finish building their alleged nuclear weapons.
Wow. Hadn't heard all of this. Been a screwed up week or so for me and I've not been keeping up with the news as much as I usually try to. Interesting reading, tho I have my automatic filters set for anything coming from the BBC.
Thanks for posting that, "Sol System". Appreciate the education on the latest.
Registered: Apr 2003
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quote:Constructive engagement would take patience and diplomacy and offer no guarantee of speedy change. Does that sound like the preferred approach of the Bush administration?
Now that says it all.
-------------------- Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war. ~ohn Adams
Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine. ~Brad DeLong
You're just babbling incoherently. ~C. Montgomery Burns
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
It is unlikely that anything done in Iran will be done overtly and in force. More likely, it will be done politically, and quietly. Reform is to be hastened, that much is certain.
Of greater interest at the moment are the recent changes in the Israel / Palestinian situation, re: the votes and acceptance of the Road Map. Sharon, so often labeled 'warmonger' by certain unfriendlies, has been the one facing down his own party, urging their government to accept the road map. The Palestinian Cabinet has already approved it, nominally, at least. Hmm.
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Of greater interest at the moment are the recent changes in the Israel / Palestinian situation, re: the votes and acceptance of the Road Map. Sharon, so often labeled 'warmonger' by certain unfriendlies, has been the one facing down his own party, urging their government to accept the road map. The Palestinian Cabinet has already approved it, nominally, at least. Hmm.
I find it a choice irony that three years ago, Ehud Barak -- a man earlier known as a conservative, borderline hard-liner (with military experience in Lebanon, IIRC) was in the exact same position, trying to force the unpleasant necessity of compromise onto the rest of his party. I believe that Ariel Sharon campaigned on the platform of Barak being too willing to compromise -- or probably for compromising at all. And now he's doing the same thing.
I'd like to think that more people are finally starting to wise up over there, but that's what we all thought ten years ago after the Oslo Accords were signed. You all know the rest of that story...
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
Registered: Nov 2000
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
It's ALSO quite likely China & Russia don't exactly relish the prospect of those new tactical nukes going off in their backyard.
Registered: Nov 1999
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quote:Originally posted by MinutiaeMan: I'd like to think that more people are finally starting to wise up over there, but that's what we all thought ten years ago after the Oslo Accords were signed. You all know the rest of that story...
It's all in the follow-through. Nobody made anybody stick to Oslo. But now, with a significant force nearby, some folks are wising up to the idea that a new treaty just might be enforceable this time.
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
What value does unilaterally enforced "peace" have? The underlying hatred isn't going to magically vanish into thin air when there are AMERICAN tanks rolling through the damn area.
quote: At the same time, Congress is likely to press for removal of the People's Mujahedeen, a group within the umbrella Iranian resistance council, from the State Department's list of terrorist organizations. Mr. Safavi, the Iranian opposition official, says a growing roster of members of Congress wants a policy that supports anti-regime forces. He predicts pressure will end up swaying the administration to adopt a policy that uses "all means available" to resist the mullahs.
quote:Originally posted by Cartmaniac: What value does unilaterally enforced "peace" have?
Ask a parent of a two-child home.
An "enforced" peace is likely to be the only kind you'll ever see in the Middle East.. at least, until it's been enforced long enough for inertia to take over.
To be honest, what I'd like to see is a perfect, yet totally unsatisfactory (to both parties)solution... the same solution my father used to propose to my brother and me when we squabbled late into the night: Accept an imposed peace, NOW, or face Destruction of both parties, regardless of farcical claims over who started it. Grumble all you want, but do it QUIETLY. The first one who acts up gets crushed.
Ideally, this threat would be backed up by an overwhelming outside military presence (Here's where the real difficulty lies -- finding a group not biased towards either the side of Israel (Like the US may be) or the Palestinians (Like much of Europe, and the UN) Maybe a joint two-power force (US-Russia?), where at least the two powers have equal say - anything they agree on gets done, hard and fast. I'm not talking about one of those piddling little 500-member "peacekeeping" forces, though. I'm talking about a group of soldiers able to project FORCE enough to keep both sides under control.
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Originally posted by First of Two: Accept an imposed peace, NOW, or face Destruction of both parties...
And it's that sort of sweet talk that makes the world swoon when the US asks it to the prom.
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
Registered: Mar 1999
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-------------------- "You are a terrible human, Ritten." Magnus "Urgh, you are a sick sick person..." Austin Powers A leek too, pretty much a negi.....
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted
Thats not a bad idea First. Create a plan that is fair (I must stipulate that it be a plan that gets some form of overall UN approval) -even if they (israel & palestine) don't like it- then simply enforce it. I'd actually support US & Russian military action in that case.
Registered: Mar 1999
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