Topic: Tort Reform in the US? Add Canada to that list.
Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
For the last week, I have been staying at my parent's place while they are in Hong Kong visiting my Grandma. Basically, I have to make sure that everything at the house is ok, mail picked up, plants watered, snow shovelled, and walkways salted if need be.
There is an area where the lawn meets the sidewalk and the driveway. It's sunken down a bit and as a result, water tends to form there quite often as snow melts. When it gets cold, that puddle turns to ice. The ice patch that forms is not in the middle of the sidewalk or the driveway, just that small area where the lawn, driveway, and sidewalk meet. Anyone with half a brain can see it and avoid it. For the last night or two, I salted that patch down so that people would not slip (just in case). After all, I had an unfortunate incident in which I slipped on a patch of ice while holding my keys, thus causing me to throw said keys 20 feet in the air where they got stuck on an eavestrough. It took me a while to shake the keys down.
This morning, I salted said puddle again before leaving to work (thought it needed more salt). The day itself was just over freezing and I got home at around 9:30 pm after running some errands after work. I went to check on that patch again. Turns out that the ice patch did melt in milder weather earlier that day but a new one formed after more snow melted and the temperature dipped during the night. As I was salting the area again, some fogey came up to me and asked if I was the owner of the house. I politely said that I was the owner's son. He then went on a tirade on how his son was delivering flyers earlier in the evening and slipped and hurt himself on that same ice patch. The one that I salted this morning. The one that melted during the day, drained itself, and froze again after more snow melted into that puddle.
He went to claim that because his son was hurt on my parent's property, he is going to sue my parents for personal injury. Initially, I apologized for the accident, but he then went in to say that it was my responsibility to make sure that the ice patch was salted THE MOMENT IT WAS FORMED. Hello, I just got home, and I went to salt that puddle as soon as I realized that a new patch of ice had formed. Besides, the area of said patch is less than half a foot squared. He then went to say that he would sue for 5-6 figures.
I then said. "Dare you to try. I think you'll be wasting a lot of time with this."
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
If the guy actually said he would "sue for 5-6 figure", I think it's obvious he's a money-grubbing whore. Unfortunately, those are the kinds of people that actually will retain a lawyer and file the suit. Unfortunately, you're parents will also probably have to get an attorney.
I don't know a thing about Canadian civil law, so I wouldn't take anything I'm to say as the gospel truth. In my opinion, the law suit would probably be thrown out. The father of the "victim" approached you as you were salting the puddle. The guy said he was going to sue with a set amount of money in mind. Other things affecting a decision on dismissal would include how badly hurt the "victim" was (I can see major trauma going through, but anything else being tossed), and whether or not part of the puddle was on government-owned/maintained property (mainly because I'm confused on where the puddle is).
Good luck.
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
Registered: Mar 1999
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Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
The man never told me the extent of what the son's injury may be only to say that he is hurt VERY bad (which I think he is exaggerating). I've slipped on plenty of ice patches and suffered mostly a bruised ego.
But here's the thing: is there some sort of law that is supposed to have immediate response to ice patches forming? I salted the damned patch this morning, it melted, and a new one formed. It's not like I deliberately left the patch there so that I wanted someone to slip on it.
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Vague on injuries; specific on money. I hate to sound so cynical about my fellow man, but I'm sensing an opportunist at work here.
As far as I know, Texas has no law on the books requiring people to salt any ice patches on their property. Houston and Harris County don't have any ordinances on it either, but we only get a major ice storm maybe once every fifteen years or so. My sister lives near the panhandle, and they get snow and ice regularly during the winter. She's never mentioned anything about being required to salt ice patches.
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
Registered: Mar 1999
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Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
Believe me, the question on whether a law exists for almost immediate removal of ice was pure sarcasm. From what I recall, you have 24 hours from snowfall to remove any snow from your sidewalk (unless you are on vacation of course). As for ice, I would imagine that it is the same thing. Like I said to him many times over, it was salted this morning, and I went to salt it again when I got home. No negligence there.....
Opportunist? Yes. Asshole? Definitely. Non-Starter of a lawsuit? I hope so, unless this guy knows an attourney who can make both Jack McCoy and Ben Stone squirm.
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Around these parts all sidewalks are maintained by the municipality in which they exist. Usually a city-owned plow-thingy goes up and down the sidewalks to clear them off (if at all; some sidewalks don't get such special treatment). The sidewalks are rarely if ever bare at all. But then again, the total population of NB is less than a suburb of Toronto, so things are probably different there.
-------------------- I haul cardboard and cardboard accessories
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
No, that is bullshit, the lawn is your parents' property, if anyone chooses to enter that property they have themselves to blame if they're not watching where they're going.
Besides, you can prove that you've been salting the patch for a while now (break a multilayered piece off and put it in the freezer), and you obviously did all the salting you could with the time you had.
Let me tell you a filthy story. Last sunday I was helping out in a church selling tickets for an opera consert and this man comes up in the line, I say the price is 100 kronor, he says he just came from the US and have only dollars on him and wanted me to take his credit card instead. I and my associate where standing at a small table stand with a tin money box, a stack of show programmes, a pencil and a paper on it. Did it look like we had a card reader and a phone line? I said that we didn't have the facilities to charge credit cards, and then this bitter old fart started going on about how the church should damn well be able to receive anyone wanting to pay them money and that we were doing a bad job and this was an outrage. I said that this concert isn't arranged by the church but by the choir itself (with the church's permission), the man got a bit blustered but responded with a curt "oh.", at which point the choir leader happened to walk by and asked if there was any trouble. After he got briefed by us he asked the man for 17$ which the man promptly payed, I gave him his free programme and everything went smooth after that. Epilogue: 100 kronor is actually 14.7$ so I see the extra two bucks as his due for being an ill prepared ass.
Moral of story: People often try to disguise opinion as fact when they want better or free service, calling them on it should shut them up.
-------------------- "I'm nigh-invulnerable when I'm blasting!" Mel Gibson, X-Men
Registered: Aug 1999
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Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
quote:Originally posted by Lee: Wait, what, you're required by law to sweep the snow from the pavement outside your house?
I'm not exactly clear on what the letter of the law is around here. From what I hear, it is 24 hours after a major snowfall. Some people say that it is the sidewalk that has to be cleared itself, but there is usually a city-owned sidewalk plow that takes care of that usually within that 24 hours. Others say it is the actual driveway, but then again, it shouldn't really matter since if you don't do it, you can't get out of your house anyway. Some others say that if you live in a road that sees considerable traffic, the driveway HAS to be cleared so that cars visiting your residence do not have to park on the road itself (more likely our case).
This only applies to Markham however (where my parents live). I do believe that the bylaws in Toronto are a bit tougher if you're closer to the downtown core, considering increased pedestrian traffic, in which case the sidewalk HAS to be plowed. Whatever the bylaw is, if there is no compliance, what happens is that the city comes in and does it for you at its discretion and they bill you for the cost.
quote:Originally posted by Nim': No, that is bullshit, the lawn is your parents' property, if anyone chooses to enter that property they have themselves to blame if they're not watching where they're going.
Over here, if a commercial business does not salt its pedestrian pathways and someone slips and injures themselves as a result, then the business can be sued for personal injury and other damages.
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
There's a difference between personal property and business property.
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
A big difference, over here in the UK if someone enters your private property - so much as a milimetre, without your permission they are a tresspasser and only have very minimal protection under the 1984 Occupier's Liability Act (which added this protection, before under '57 Act they were on their own) Now as long as you don't actively try and harm people entering your property you're safe, things like ice, if it's too much effort on your part to fix the problem then it's okay.
Business over here are screwed over in favour of the claimant just like you guys though.
-------------------- Garbled, confusing and quite frankly duller than an inflight magazine produced by Air Belgium.
Registered: May 2004
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posted
Wile snow is never an issue where I live, In Florida if someone is on your property without your invitation or permission, they enter at their own risk.
For instance, if your dog bites someone posting flyers (on your property), it'd their fault for entering your property without permission.
Best bet: talk with your dad about it first and then call the local non-emergency police number to ask what (if anything) your responsibility could be and be sure to mention that this guy seems out for money. You'll be on record as doing the right thing and this guy's attempt o shake you down will also be on record.
Did anyone even witness this supposed fall? If not, feel free to laugh in this old fuck's face. I sure would. (of coure, see my sig-line for Nim's opinion of my advice)
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
Laughing in the face of old fucks is not the same as abetting triple whoring on lonesome bachelor nights to impressionable youths.
Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Well, it depends on how you laugh at them. I can put a lot of emphasis into a laugh.
In this case it would be along the lines of "HA HA! Your kid shatterted his pelvis on my property! You should've really given him more dairy products for strong bones I guess..."
Or a simple "Sucks to be you." might work as well.
And I stand by my stance on whoring: nothings wrong with it as long as you use protection.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
posted
Find the guys address, go over and "slip" on a patch of ice in his driveway.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
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