posted
So, basically, what you're saying is "your argument against me is wrong because you don't understand what I'm saying, but I'm not going to tell you what I'm saying"?
Registered: Mar 1999
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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posted
Well, I would, but I'd have to go to Florida & spend about a month sitting around with him & teaching him.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
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-------------------- Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war. ~ohn Adams
Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine. ~Brad DeLong
You're just babbling incoherently. ~C. Montgomery Burns
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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posted
Evidently not, since I don't have one yet. And I am NOT going to end up like Milton did with the birthday cake.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
Naturally as soon as VT happened the lefties started harping on gun control, 'cause guns were involved. A gun did give a relatively efficient method of murder, but the psycho could've killed as many if not more via other means once he'd chained up the exits.
Of course, the fact that the kid was a left-leaning wacko with a couple of wee pistols in a gun-free zone gets left under the radar in the liberal media. Same with that leftist nut who threatened a Republican with a rifle in Nevada.
The presence of firearms might make trouble in some individual cases, or even many of them, but the thought of a disarmed populace is appalling. In some cases, the point of guns is to make trouble for those who would prefer you to be disarmed, be they criminals or totalitarians.
Now, should a guy with a record of being a nutjob have been able to get a gun? No, clearly not. But while this should've been a watershed event on keeping our loonies contained a bit better (hell, people on mental disability in this country can still vote!), instead the lefties have screwed it up by making it about guns.
'Cause, you know, chained doors, a fire alarm, and some gas-cans/IEDs wouldn't have killed anybody.
-------------------- . . . ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
"'Cause, you know, chained doors, a fire alarm, and some gas-cans/IEDs wouldn't have killed anybody."
I'm left wondering who these "anti-gun, pro-IED" people are. Most people I know who are anti-gun are also anti-bomb.
"There is a growing distinction between liberal and conservative media these days."
I would say the opposite. There's a growing similarity between the just-plain-conservative media, and the conservative-because-they-are-corporate-tools media.
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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posted
quote:Originally posted by TSN: I'm left wondering who these "anti-gun, pro-IED" people are. Most people I know who are anti-gun are also anti-bomb.
That would be me.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
What? You're anti-gun, anti-bomb, or anti-gun, pro-bomb?
In recent months there's been a spate of murders of young black men, predominantly in south London. While at least one of these involved one kid being shot in his own bed using a machine-pistol, most of them have been committed by gangs wielding knives and hammers. I don't know if the pro-gun wingnuts in the States have picked up on these (knowledge of world affairs not being any of your's strong points), but if they had I'm sure they'd have lauded the circumstances. Primarily, of course, because to these people a few less black people is a Good Thing; ostensibly, though, they'd be quick to crow that it is proof that our gun control legislation does not stop murders.
Most of these kids weren't involved in anything gang-related, so it appears their murders were either cases of mistaken identity, or they were randomly-selected as targets of opportunity for gang initiations. I'm quite sure that had the gangs had the access to firearms, they'd have just gunned them down (unless the close-in getting-hands-bloody bit is all part of the initiation). But they weren't, because guns are illegal here and they're not that easy to get hold of! When guns are prevalent, then all it takes for one to be stolen or sold improperly and it becomes "Huh, an illegal gun, nothing we can do about that, it's immune from gun control legislation."
posted
Guardian implies that the same scrawny nut could have killed a bunch of people without a gun: bullshit. If he had a machette or other large blade and locked 30 college kids in a room, he's have that machette up his ass within minutes.
Guns are a pussy weapon- plain and simple. You just kill via remote control with no direct interaction- just point and click. That's why it's both so popular and so prevalant- it's easy. it's why the whole world adopted them as the tool of warfare- any idiot can be trained on their use in no time.
The gun lobby is pretty quiet on this one- smartly so too- they know full well the backlash waiting if they give their lame-ass "guns dont kill people" line. Instead they're "very concerned about this loophole in the Brady Bill" that allowed Cho to get a gun legally despite being batshit crazy.
Of course, they fail to mention how they've fought to repeal the Brady bill since it's inception.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
Yes, I said "liberal media", 'cause they say it's that themselves. Ted Turner (founder of CNN), when making fun of Fox News, said it was okay for there to be a conservative media, since 'we have ours' or words to that effect, to an audience of other liberals.
And yes, I'm aware that "knife control" has been discussed in some countries with a gun ban, which is great 'cause gun crimes also happen in those countries, meaning that in the event of a gunman one would be left with kicking. If that happened, though, I'd imagine there'd be "steel-toe/pointy boot control" soon thereafter.
And no, I didn't posit a machete, though given the situation as it happened I rather doubt that a machete/chainsaw/sword/whatever would've been terribly less effective. The kids were scared and ran for it, which is perfectly understandable . . . but the point is that nobody tried to (or even probably had time to) set up a situation where they could take down Cho, and I find it unlikely that this would've been the case without the popping of gunfire, judging by what I've read. But I freely admit I don't know the precise movements and timeline of those involved.
In any event, I posited something more evil involving fire or a homemade bomb. I'm not saying anyone is anti-gun and pro-bomb . . . I'm saying evil sonsabitches don't need a gun to be evil sonsabitches.
-------------------- . . . ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
quote:Originally posted by Guardian 2000: I'm saying evil sonsabitches don't need a gun to be evil sonsabitches.
But it sure helps.
GUns give a sense of power over others (thus their popularity to some extent) and a psycho sure can use that to get up te nerve to carry out his sick fantasies.
No way would anyone with a sword/knife/whatever have been able to kill 32 people: anyone tossing a chair would have stopped Cho: that argument does not hold water. Nothing points to Cho having the ability to make an explosive- no points there either.
Even the airline passengers during the 9/11 attacks- in a confined space and against several well trained aggressors (armed with box-cutter knives) managed to mount an effective offense- something they'd probably never have attempted against someone with a gun.
Cho would have gone down- probably after only an assualt with a bladed weapon- it's a hell of a lot tougher to kill someone with a blade, and they fight back.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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"...ostensibly, though, they'd be quick to crow that it is proof that our gun control legislation does not stop murders."
Of course, if they did try to make that arguement, it wouldn't be difficult to point out that anyone entertaining the idea that "gun control stops all murders" would be an idiot. In the world of reality, though, we could compare the numbers of murders in the US and the UK and see whether gun control stops a lot of murders.
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