Especially the "12 commandments" are annoying me, because there is virtually nothing useful about them, most of them are not even true. I wonder if people who permanently pick at Voyager do actually watch the show.

My comments:

1) "Get moving." - Agreed. Voyager is too often shown standing still while the ship should be at warp. But one has to take into account that the series preferably shows the moments in which this is not the case. A ship at high warp all the time (i.e. in the 95% time which is not shown on screen) would be even much more boring.

2) "Get rid of the uniforms." - I also like the new style better, but this is about the least relevant argument I've ever heard, rather a sign of a lack of arguments. Do the people really care about such trivialities?

3) "Show us actual relationships. Riker and Troi had one." - Riker and Troi? Are you kidding? They didn't have a relationship during all TNG until "Insurrection". Did this guy ever watch TNG?

4) "Speaking of relationships, get Ensign Kim one." - What would this change and would this be realistic? I think it's rather realistic that there are hardly any relationships on Voyager. Falling in love with an alien is not very useful, since the ship is going to move on, and on Voyager itself the "resources" are limited. Once men and women have decided that they do at most like each other, any deeper relationship would be excluded, as long as there is still hope to get home. - "After six years, none of the main characters have gotten promotions..." - Apart from the fact that this is wrong (Tuvok was promoted), what would this change again?

5) "Why isn't there a Maquis clique on the show?" - Agreed, but now that the two crews have merged without difficulties it's too late for this.

6) "Give the Doctor a name." - I think it's not a bad running joke or lack of ideas but a sign of his emerged self-awareness that it's getting harder and harder to actually settle upon a name. Try to change something you have gotten used to.

7) "Get rid of stupid and improbable story lines." - Agreed, the superiority of the DF is incredible. However, the vehicle must not be mistaken as the actual storyline, it's at most one element in it. Why do people always see the show as more technical than it actually is?

8) "Tell us the truth about Neelix." - Needless to comment on this one which alone disqualifies the whole argumentation. Voyager - your weekly slash show.

9) "Give Chakotay something to do." - Chakotay doesn't have much to do, but why is this always criticised on Voyager while it's accepted for Riker on the E-D? Janeway is the active part and needs someone calm to rely on, someone to ask for advice, just as Kirk needed McCoy. Is this suddenly a bad idea beacuse it's Voyager or because Janeway is a woman?

10) "Write some more stories." - I agree that the mentioned plots did show up more than once and I'm not lucky about it either. However, this is maybe 10 or 12 episodes out of 120. Too bad if you accidentally missed all the rest.

11) "Be consistent." - Maybe the villains do not appear again because Voyager has left them behind? Just a broad hint. And anyway, who says that the villains of Voyager are not popular? And anyway, who says that there has to be a villain all the time? Was DS9 better because of the persistent (and consistent) Dominion threat?

12) "Finally, quit copping out." - A superficial argument again. Not everyone thinks it is exciting when nothing is left to our imagination.

Because they give us "isorams" and "tetryon plasma" and such.

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Death before Dishonor!
However Dishonor has
quite a disputed defintion.

I agree with the fact that people keep bringing up weak arguments against Voyager. It's getting old. If you don't like the characters, fine, you can state it once and then be done with. By repeating it over and over, it only wastes not only your time by exclaiming it, but it also wastes the time of those who would happen upon it to read it.

I have to say that this also is applicable to those who watch the show despite the fact that they don't like it. What's the point? If I don't like something, I don't watch it. If Voyager is such torture to some people, why purposefully subject yourself to it, only to end up b*tching about later to others that really don't want to hear it.

Most of my arguments, though, are in another post ("Some Comments"), so I won't waste anymore space here.

Bernd, thank for letting me rant! Its been a long week. :-)

All of these comments are moot, considering all these facts will be changed sometime in the future.. They are complaining about something, and they have no clue as to what's to come!!!

Sure.. Chakotay needs a woman. So does Harry.. Does it have to be a crew memeber??? Well.. If I were stranded in the DQ for 7 years.. I think I'd be lookin'.. But, too many romantic story lines would make Voyager a 24th Century Harlequin Romance. And that's NOT the direction I'd want it to go... RIGHT??

Voyager has a good mix of technical and not so technical. I think people should simply stop bitching and enjoy the show.. Let come what may come!!

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Alshrim Dax

Most of you know me for my "infamous" VOY bashing from a few weeks ago. Well I've been thinking about it and I'd like to make an apology. I realised now that those were my personal opinion and I see now that most VOY bashers are trying to force their opinion on others.

It doesn't mean my apreciation of VOY has changed mind you, just that I won't be advertising it as much.

Note: I hope I don't sound too sappy by writing this 'cause the last three topics I answered went dead almost imediately

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-If you ask me, I think continuity is highly overrated...
*Brannon Braga*

-Give me Good Trek or give me Death!
*Me*

I do think they need to come up with some better more continuing stories though.

What I don't like is that opinions are presented like facts, assuming that everyone must support it. It has been discussed in the forum that Voyager's quality is not as high as it could be and that a fifth series is not likely to be better. However, pseudo-arguments beginning with "as we all think..." or "what we can do..." explicitly exclude and possibly offend those who have opposite opinions. I think it's a matter of sensitivity to a topic to avoid the "we-know-the-truth" tone. In brief: Please express your opinions, but don't try to force them upon the others.

They used Vorek for the Pon Farr w/ B'Elanna ep and that was that.. I haven't seen him since.. and I liked him. The actor, whatever his name, palyed a grrreat Vulcan.

I think we'd have a lot more Tuvok/Vorek eps if he were still around.

I'd like to see more Vulcan content in some up-coming Voyagers. I know there were predictions that there would be this season, but so far the only real ep with Tuvok in it, he was like a child ( not one of my faves ). I wanna see the genius at work, you know??