posted
OK, just a number of things reguarding the uniforms in "Court Martial".
Firstly we have seen Command positions have the Yellow uniforms (or green) in TOS. The along comes Commander Stone in Red at Starbase 11. The Enterprise was at this Starbase for repairs. Does this mean that Starbase 11 was primarily an Engineering base?
Also, What is with the other people on the 'board' overseeing Kirk's trial. They are all in Dress uniform, but, they are not all in Green/Yellow... Stone is in Red, and the the two Captains to his Right are in their own colours... Blue for one of them at least. Does this mean that they are Captains but retain their non command colour?
The only other time we have seen this is in "The Die is Cast" When from the SAME planet/Starbase 11 we have that subspace message from the Starfleet Security Admiral in Yellow!
Also, in TOS, the Insignia on the uniforms change for each Starship... When Kirk was in the Bar, there were other Starship crews there - and Kirk mentions that they are also graduating members of his class... (he actually talks like it was both his and McCoy's graduating clasS) anyway they all have on Enterprise insignia, when they should have other starship insignia on.
BTW, in "Balance Of Terror" did anyone get a look at the Starbase Commander's insignia? It was different.
Andrew
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posted
AndrewR, are you Court Martial happy today???
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posted
A Court Martial board would be made up of various officers from various branches. Which is why they're wearing different uniform colors.
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posted
OK, that is another instance, its only Scotty and these other two Captains/Commodores then, that we've seen stay in their Division colours even though they are of the rank of Captain... (oh plus that Admiral from The Die Is Cast) Everyone else has assumed the 'command' colours. Spock in the Movies, Beverly in All Good Things... I assumed by the dialogue in "Court Martial" that these other two captains (plus another commodore) were Starship Captains.
------------------ Homer: I'm gonna miss Springfield. This town's been awfully good to us. Bart: No, it hasn't, Dad. That's why we're leaving. Homer: Oh, yeah. [pokes his head out the window] So long, Stinktown!
Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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posted
Couldn't all of this have gone in one topic?
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posted
I think the other captains were told to have been starship captains at some point, but it might be that they had since moved on with their careers.
In addition to Stone, another Commodore wore red for official business, even if we didn't see his dress uniform. Comm. Stocker, due to command SB 10, was a redshirt in "The Deadly Years". So that's two redshirt starbase-commanding Commodores against one goldshirt.
Perhaps red signifies starbase command, while gold signifies starbase command PLUS command of significant military forces in the sector? Or perhaps starbase command PLUS command of a starship (say, perhaps Mendez had a ship of his own like Sisko had the Defiant?).
However, the most appealing of all interpretations to me is that beyond a certain rank, people with multiple proficiencies can CHOOSE the colors they wear in occasions like this. If they value their science career higher than the fact that they command a starship, then they wear blue. If they like to remind everybody that they are gruff soldiers or hard-working engineers, they wear mustard even at flag rank. It's their personal choice.
As for the insignia of the people at the base, I'd forget all about that being the Enterprise insignum. Instead, based on the evidence here, I'd interpret it as the insignum of "6th Fleet" or something. Each such fleet would only have one or two big starships in them, in addition to smaller vessels and bases, which nicely explains why the Exeter and the Constellation crews had different insignia - they came from "2nd Fleet" and "5th Fleet", respectively!
Better still, make the arrowhead the "1st Fleet" insignum, so that when Starfleet decided to simplify its system, it naturally chose the "Number One" symbol and dropped the others.
posted
Regarding Spock: I'd say he started wearing white because, in ST II, he was "command" rather than "Science". He was in command of the Enterprise at any rate. When he officially resumed science duties under Kirk (end of ST IV), he kept the white, because by that point, it really didn't matter what they wore. They were "The Enterprise" crew. They could do whatever they wanted.
Scotty was always an Engineer. Which is why he never changed colours. Remember the "Captain of Engineering" line?
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Re the insignia... when did we see those alternate insignia?? season 2 and 3? or just 1, because if those appeared all before "court martial" we could push back the date that the Enterprise insignia became the 'fleet' standard symbol.
------------------ Homer: I'm gonna miss Springfield. This town's been awfully good to us. Bart: No, it hasn't, Dad. That's why we're leaving. Homer: Oh, yeah. [pokes his head out the window] So long, Stinktown!
"All except you Mr. Scott. We need your wisdom on the new Excelsior. I want you to report there tomorrow as CAPTAIN [emphasis his] of Engineering."
As for the insignia... "Court Martial" is about 2/3 through the 1st season (episode #15 in the production order, #20 in aired order). After these insignia show up in "Court Martial" we have the very distinct insignia of the Constellation early in the 2nd season and the insignia of the Exeter late in the 2nd season. Other than those, I don't think we ever saw any.
--Jonah
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[This message has been edited by Peregrinus (edited April 20, 2001).]
posted
And, so did the different Starbases - although all their insignia were the same - they were stars or starburst patterns. Also, the commander of one of the Earth outposts in "Balance Of Terror" had a different insignia... could anyone post a screen cap?
This really stuffs up the whole insignia thing - with these Enterprise insignia turning up in "Court Martial". Another one for the continuity gaffs book(s)?
------------------ Homer: I'm gonna miss Springfield. This town's been awfully good to us. Bart: No, it hasn't, Dad. That's why we're leaving. Homer: Oh, yeah. [pokes his head out the window] So long, Stinktown!
posted
As observed by Peregrinus, the separate insignia for starships were not truly established until the 2nd season of TOS. This being the case, its not too hard to look past the use of the Enterprise insignia during "Court Martial". They had to start somewhere...
posted
We, did though - get other insignia during season 1.
As mentioned
The ship from Charlie X. The commander of the Earth Outpost in Balance of Terror Numerous Starbase crews with the 'starburst' insignia. I guess, with the exception of "Court Martial" we didn't get to see any other STARSHIP crew members - i.e. the bigger ships of the fleet... did we?
------------------ Homer: I'm gonna miss Springfield. This town's been awfully good to us. Bart: No, it hasn't, Dad. That's why we're leaving. Homer: Oh, yeah. [pokes his head out the window] So long, Stinktown!
posted
The different chest insignia we have seen in Star Trek are the following:
Enterprise Starbase/HQ personnel (starburst configuration) USS Exeter crew (long rectangle with circles) Constellation crew (styliezed capital I) Antares crew (oddly circular design) and there were 2 from the animateds shown as well from 2 other ships.
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