posted
It would appear we seem a wee bit obsessed with the idea that Rick S and Rick S alone can design starships "correctly."
-------------------- "I was surprised by the matter-of-factness of Kafka's narration, and the subtle humor present as a result." (Sizer 2005)
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
To address an earlier comment, I would point out that the Equinox was by no means an original design. Go get yourself a copy of the DS9TM.
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by The_Tom: It would appear we seem a wee bit obsessed with the idea that Rick S and Rick S alone can design starships "correctly."
Personally, I always prefered Andy Probert's ships to Sterbach's. His ships always seem more thought out and consistent in design details. The E-D, Warbird and Ferengi ships are great designs, and very distinct. Too many of the designs that followed his depaerture are like masses of shapes shoved together. Curves against angles, blocks shoved through discs. Take the Klingon Attack Cruiser, rip off its nacelles, turn it around and paint it yellow and you have the Cardassian Galor. Weak.
-------------------- "Well, I mean, it's generally understood that, of all of the people in the world, Mike Nelson is the best." -- ULTRA MAGNUS, steadfast in curmudgeon
posted
Ryan: ultimately, the reason the Sistine Chapel remains highly regarded today is that a bunch of people argued for centuries over whether it was a good or a bad design, resulting in a general agreement that it was. What Michelangelo thought wouldn't have mattered if he were a bad artist in most people's opinion.
I never said only Rick could do original designs. I feel the Defiant is a lot more original than anything Rick did, and so is the Enterprise-E. All I'm saying is what I said -- Rick should've done the blueprints that make sure every detail works from an engineering standpoint, and that it is not just a cool shape that served a different purpose on the original ship. He did this for the Enteprise-E by Eaves, DS9 (designed by himself, Zimmerman, Okuda, and a few other people), etc.
Doug Drexler should be able to do all that, having done all the MSDs, but I feel he didn't know how many of the details he should modify while keeping the producers happy. Another reason could be a lack of Probert's industrial design background or Rick's enthusiasm for real-world engineering and space vehicles.
Oh, and I do like Probert's designs a lot -- unfortunately, he hasn't been working for Trek in a while, so asking him to help out might be less practical.
As for the Equinox, it isn't a plaigarism of the pathfinder -- the Equinox *is* the pathfinder, and besides, the pathfinder configuration was never built.
Personally, I always prefered Andy Probert's ships to Sterbach's. His ships always seem more thought out and consistent in design details. The E-D, Warbird and Ferengi ships are great designs, and very distinct. Too many of the designs that followed his depaerture are like masses of shapes shoved together. Curves against angles, blocks shoved through discs. Take the Klingon Attack Cruiser, rip off its nacelles, turn it around and paint it yellow and you have the Cardassian Galor. Weak.
Now, hang on . . . the Ferengi ship is a knock-off Klingon design. It's got the same "Head-neck-main hull-guns and warp engines on the sides of the main hull" configuration as the K'tingas (with the guns off of the BoP).
Guardian 2000
-------------------- . . . ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
posted
"To address an earlier comment, I would point out that the Equinox was by no means an original design. Go get yourself a copy of the DS9TM."
I haven't got it, but didn't the Equinox look like one of the Nova-class prototypes at the end of the TNG Tech Manual?
"Take the Klingon Attack Cruiser, rip off its nacelles, turn it around and paint it yellow and you have the Cardassian Galor. Weak. "
I've done that mentally, and I've got a back to front yellow Klingon ship with no nacelles.
By "Klingon Attack Cruiser", do you mean the ship introduced in season 4 of TNG? The Vor'cha class ship (I think)?
That always struck me as being a TNG version of the K'Tinga. It's more rounded, in the same way that the Ent-D is more rounded than the original. The Galor looks like an Egyption Ankh, I believe, and the Cardassian symbol from above. I can't see how they look similar at all.
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
posted
Well, if you removed the nacelles from a Vor'cha and turned it around, it *would* resemble a Galor with a rectangular head. Galor's head is more like a semicircle, but they would have the same fork in the tail as well. And they're also exactly the same design size
But that wasn't the point -- the point is that Rick's designs are more plausible from an engineering standpoint because of his interest in real-world space vehicles and Star Trek technology.
posted
Do you ever read before you post? I said Rick can make the details consistent and believable from an engineering standpoint, not that he's the best overall designer. Probert can do that too, maybe even better, but unfortunately he hasn't worked for Star Trek since 1988.
posted
So the Defiant isn't believable becuase the designer didn't sit down and determine how many decks it had? Well, hell, if that's all it takes ...
posted
The Defiant is *not* a lead series ship or station. Even if it were, it was designed in the most chaotic period of Star Trek production, when "Generations" and "Voyager" were in preproduction while DS9 was finishing its second season and TNG its seventh. Even so, it didn't copy a single detail from previous Federation starships (why else couldn't we find its size?), and certainly did not assign a different purpose to similar-looking details.
The Enterprise should be compared to the DS9 station, Enterprise-E, Enterprise-A, Enterprise-D, TOS-Enterprise or Voyager.
quote:The Enterprise should be compared to the DS9 station, Enterprise-E, Enterprise-A, Enterprise-D, TOS-Enterprise or Voyager.
Okay.
Compared to the ships you've mentioned, its a refreshing change of design. But, oh, it wasn't designed by Sternbach so it must suck dick.
As for the Defiant, it *was* a lead ship (I doubt anyone but you considers it not) -- it had a lot more then just "ship in background" status. And, gee, it wasn't designed by Sternbach. It thus must suck dick.
posted
No, it just wasn't *blueprinted and refined* by Sternbach, Probert, Jefferies, or anyone with an engineering background. I don't care who designs it. The only refreshing thing about it is that it was designed like it was some Yeager or Cheyenne or New Orleans class.
Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged
Printer-friendly view of this topic
