posted
Yah, Mojo. I think what you're thinking of is the comment that was made about the machine planet that the Voyager probe apparently encountered that changed it. It was suggested that that planet was a Borg planet. However, the Borg would've existed long before the Voyager probe.
I liked what they did with that whole thing in the book too. Especially how that fact that Spock had melded with V'Ger gave him a certain relationship with the Borg. Pretty cool.
posted
I might guess that the Borg originated as a society something like 1984. The implants would be something like uber-thought police. Such a hive mind would seem to be the logical conclusion of such a society.
My problem with the Borg has always been, exactly what is this hive mind? It's CAN'T be the collective, average will of all the drones, because the majority would have been unwilling assimilates. I'm wondering if the collective consiousness isn't some sort of self-replicating computer program...
-------------------- "This is why you people think I'm so unknowable. You don't listen!" - God, "God, the Devil and Bob"
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Well, I would submit that, since anyone assimilated into the Collective seems to hear the voices of the everyone in his head, they assimilated are probably completely swept away. Try thinking for yourself when 50 people shout in your simultaneously. Now, picture those voices in your mind, knowing what you're thinking, scared, panicked, telling you what to do... it seems that it would be basically impossible to keep a hold on your individuality.
posted
I think that was a reference to the fact that theh were pulled out of the obscurity of being nothing but background extras...
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I don't know, I'm really taken with the idea that the Borg already existed as a machine race, but that Decker and Ilia fusing with V'Ger was the turning point for them - realizing that organic life forms should not be wiped out, but JOINED with - that they hold a valuable asset - is a very intriguing concept.
It also ties everything together, which I like.
Although, at the time, it seemed like joining with V'Ger was the right, wonderous, beautiful thing to do - it would be ironic if that was the moment that evolved the Borg into the creatures that we know and love today.
It would go back to what Q was warning us about - Humans aren't ready for everything, and our actions can have far-flung ramifications; even things we cannot conceive of.
posted
I'm rather ick on the idea of tying V'Ger and the Borg together, Moj. Largely, I guess, for the reason that the Borg have almost certainly been scooting about assimilating people for longer than either the the events of TMP of the launch of Voyager 6. But I'm also a little wary about the notion of the book filling in huge sweeping Trek timeline holes. I mean, there's "Unseen" and then there's "Unseen." Showing us the Battle of Donatu V is one thing, but explaining away such longstanding sources of fan speculation as say the Klingon forehead dilemma is probably going to irk more people than it satisfies. I think taking the big leap and explaining the origin of the Borg in great detail and with a pretty "pat" explanation that ties in Kirk and co. to a pan-Galactic menace falls under that category. Vaguely intimating that Starfleet suspects the Borg were a race that let technology run amok is probably less likely to give the reader the impression that the book is swinging in and "messing" with their view of Trek canon.
Am I making sense?
-------------------- "I was surprised by the matter-of-factness of Kafka's narration, and the subtle humor present as a result." (Sizer 2005)
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I can't tell, my eyelids are dropping down all the time. Also, that thing Sol slipped in under the door was very depressing. Talk about killing God. I don't like gloomy prophecies, they give me a bellyache, and I've got a beauty right now.
And it's "swedish"! Single E! If there's one thing this damn country doesn't need it's additional E's!
I think Berlinghoff might've accidentally created the borg as he used the john on that timeship of his, see what you can make of that. Ho Ho, fu*king ho, delta quad!
Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Oh, and Tom? Can you please check your personal message bin, you kind of missed out on the "feedback" department. I sent Capps some too but he couldn't be arsed, apparently. (New addition for Oxford English Dictionary 3rd Edition, "Arsed". Scout's honor) .-)
Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Although I like the Borg, one aspect annoys me about them. If the Borg have been around for so long and assimilated so many species, you would think they would be able to prevent all the damn boarding parties that the Voyager crew seems to love so much.
Or can this be seen as a downside to a collective mind? I would be interested to know what explanation there is for the Borg’s tech level as opposed to how long they have been around and how many species they have assimilated.
The TNG Borg and even the FC Borg seem so much more believable than the Voyager Borg. Maybe the Borg have only mainly encountered species with tech levels below that of Voyager and aren’t as untouchable as they should be.
-------------------- More human than human -Blade Runner
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Mojo, I like the idea of tying the two plot lines together. The thing that mostly would make it unworkable in my opinion (and this has pretty much been stated above) is that the time line already clearly contradicts it. The Queen has intimated that the Borg were once organic and other races have been familiar with the Borg way before the events of TMP.
I don't have any problem believing that V'Ger and the Borg are somehow connected (how many machine planets/races do we want in this galaxy, anyway?) but I just can't swallow the idea that V'Ger represented a fundamental shift in the Borg's existance.
posted
since v'ger had "learned all that was possible to be learned" (or something like that) in this galaxy or even the whole universe, i don't think that anything made from v'ger would have any problem getting rid of a pesky federation of planets in a backwoods part of the galaxy. also, all canon trek timelines and, IMNSHO, common sense rule out the borg being related to v'ger (or at least coming from v'ger). Besides, who would want to determine anything that momentous based on a shatner novel .
posted
Kosa: Knowledge assimilated by the Borg are suppose to be evenly distributed throughout the collective. What one cube knows, eventually all does.
The Borg in Voyager assimilated Braga and a whole bunch of bad writers, that's why they're so weak.
-------------------- "God's in his heaven. All's right with the world."
Registered: Apr 2001
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