Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
We know that the Federation doesn't like war, and that a typical Fed. starship only has about 2 to 5% of its internal space "dedicated" to weapons. So, I was wondering when they are going to change that policy. I've compiled two lists (not in chronological order though) of all the confrontations that the Enterprise-D and the Voyager have lost so far, regardless of the situation (the Voyager list stops at "Equinox". I have done this for no reason other then the fact that I'm bored, and because I want to convince everyone that these two ships are not as great as everyone always says. Enjoy!
----------------------------------------------------- Enterprise-D: (supposedly most powerful ship in fleet up to "ST 8: First Contact")
-Echo Papa device ("The Arsenal of Freedom") -Hussnock vessel ("The Survivors") -Klingon Bird-of-Prey ("Star Trek 7: Generations") -Romulan Warbird ("The Defector") -Romulan Warbird ("Tin Man") -Klingon Bird-of-Prey ("Rascals") -Borg Cube ("Q Who") -Tamarian vessel ("Darmok") -Zalkonian vessel ("Transfigurations") -Ferengi Marauder ("The Battle") -Klingon Bird-of-Prey ("Yesterday's Enterprise") -Cardassian Galor ("Parallels")
Voyager: (supposedly one of the fastest and most redundant ships in the fleet)
-Kazon Mothership ("Caretaker") -Kazon Raiders + Mothership ("Basics") -Kazon Raiders ("*.*" => a first-season episode) -Hirogen vessels ("The Killing Game") -Hirogen vessels ("*.*" => other episode with Hirogen in it, where they chase this species 8472 ship) -Species 8472 vessels ("Scorpion") -Etanian Order vessel ("*.*" => episode with orbital tether thing) -*.* vessel ("Distant Origin") -Robot vessel ("Prototype") -Tak Tak vessel ("Macrocosm") -Krenim vessels ("Year of Hell") -*.* vessels ("*.*" => episode where Kim is lured to planet with beautiful women for his DNA) -Malon Freigther ("Void") -*.* vessels ("Think Thank" => episode where some kind of mercenaries put Voyager in paradox situation; weird bunch of people from neutronium-based ship come to the "rescue")
I have undoubtly forgotten many more but since this is all coming from my memory (which suffers from gaps lately) I think I've done well. Oh well, for SF's sake, they'd better start working on some GOOD ships if they want to survive in the future.
------------------ "Cry havoc and let's slip the dogs of Evil"
[This message has been edited by The_Evil_Lord (edited January 18, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by The_Evil_Lord (edited January 18, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by The_Evil_Lord (edited January 19, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by The_Evil_Lord (edited January 20, 2000).]
posted
Also, it might be worth noting that except for Husnock and Zalkonian vessels, the E-D managed to wallop the same opponents in other episodes (and the Husnock ship was cheating - and a rematch would be impossible anyway). So it's more of a "fortunes of war" thing than a sign of inferior capabilities.
As for the Voyager losing to the Kazon... I would have liked to see more of that. Having the Voyager win battles is poor drama, when the elements of her being stranded and separated from repair facilities could be used much more dramatically.
posted
Isn't the Voyager a scout ship...it doesn't matter if the ship is the newest if it isn't designed for battle...and in all those encounters the voyager either didn't fire at all or the captain gave the order too late (after trying a diplomatic solution while being fired on) of they were clearly outnumbered (kazon encounters (discard the kazon low tech)) or the enemy was tecnologically superior or had some other advantage...
I think it would be better if Voyager was a Dreadnought or something...
------------------ Dream on...in the end...dreams are everything...
posted
Marko: But Voyager ISN'T a dreadnaught and she WASN'T designed for battle. While at the beginning of the series, she had far more advanced tech than others in that area of space, she didn't necessarily have more powerful weapons.
------------------ "A gathering of Angels appeared above my head. They sang to me this song of hope, and this is what they said..." -Styx
posted
One has to remember that voyager faced not only one ship but sometimes two or three ships. Not even a sovereign class ship can survive several kazon, hirogen or any other race from the Delta quadrant.
------------------ "We set sail on this new sea because their is new knowledge to be gained and new rights to be won" John F Kennedy
posted
Also, the E-D was not destroyed by 1 BOP in "Yesterday's Enterprise". She was fighting 3 K'Vort class Battlecruisers, and was still in 1 piece when the E-C entered the temporal rift. It's possible that reinforcment arrived, and pulled her out of the fire. Yet, it's also possible she was blown to pieces. We'll never know.
------------------ "I see you have the ring. And that your Schwartz is as big as mine! -Dark Helmet, Spaceballs
Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
Except that the K'Vort is supposedly the same size as a B'Rel (the BoP paradox ) that's why I wrote down BoP for that episode (you'll also note that I didn't bother with how MANY ships were attacking since the E-D SHOULD have been able to handle them)
------------------ "Cry havoc and let's slip the dogs of Evil"
posted
Reject the core, eh? Is that what you do if the warp drive asks you out, but you aren't interested? :-)
------------------ Col. Maybourne: "Teal'c... It's good to see you well." Teal'c: "In my culture, I would be well within my rights to dismember you." -Stargate SG-1: "Touchstone"
- and a rematch would be impossible anyway). So it's more of a "fortunes of war" thing than a sign of inferior capabilities.
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