posted
I just saw the new issue of ST: The Magazine, and was delighted to see an article on the Cardassian Hideki-class "fighter" (actually, more of a gunboat/escort class going by it's size and crew of around 30). However, it states that it has "four forward spiral disruptors, one aft disruptor, and possibly other weapons". This would most probably be a photon torpedo laucher or two, IMHO. I've seen (somewhere, I forget what page exactly) photos of the actual studio model, and have the 1/650 resin kit of the Hideki, but nowhere can I locate where these weapon emitters would be located! It says in the article they are on the ventral surface, and unfortunately, the foldout plans don't include an underside view....any ideas, anyone?
posted
The weapon complement comes from the DS9 Technical Manual, a profoundly faulty work in the eyes of many. The chapters on various enemy and ally ships especially were cobbled together in great haste, and should perhaps better be ignored.
In aired episodes, it has been well established that the weapons used aboard Cardassian ships are called "phasers", or sometimes (only once AFAIK, in "Return to Grace", and even then only in reference to a handgun) "phase disruptors". There *is* some spiral nature to the special effects, at least in the early seasons, but I'd hesitate to call the weapons "disruptors" in any case. Cardassians do use disruptors as planetary defence cannon, as stated in the same "Return to Grace"...
The Hidekis have been shown firing a single moderately powerful phaserlike beam from under the bow, or alternatively (I think.. or am I just imagining this?) two beams from the sides of the bow, one per side. No torpedoes have been shown launched, but the one Hideki in "Tribunal" apparently established a "photon lock" to the runabout of the O'Briens (as stated by the runabout computer), perhaps suggesting it was indeed armed with photon torpedoes.
posted
Something related: Was anyone else surprised when the tiny Hideki pulled up along the JemHadar Attack Ship in "Tacking into the Wind"? Previously (in "Call to Arms" and "Sacrifice of Angels") we saw that the Hideki-class was the same size as the Jemmy Bug, but the one in "Tacking..." was only about the same size as a runabout. This is pretty similar to what they did with the Kazon raider and shuttle (much smaller ver of the same external design). Anyway, I thought it was worth bringing up.
------------------ "Forgive me if I don't share your euphoria!" (Weyoun to Dukat, Tears of the Prophets) Dax's Ships of STAR TREK
posted
I saw that episode yesterday, and it was refered to as a shuttle. So maybe one of the two is a scaled version.
Another thing: The Hedeki Class has some design elements very similar to the Defiant Class, and that appearantly includes 4 special front weapons. Are there more people out there that think that the Hedeki is based on the Defiant Class design (in Star Trek!)?
------------------ "I think I speak for everyone here when I say, 'Huh?'." - Buffy
posted
When I compare the Hideki to the runabout carrying Miles O'Brien in "Tribunal", and then compare the runabout to the jemmie-bug in "Treachery, faith and the great river" I get a Hideki less than half the size of a bug. Is there a set figure for the Hideki?
------------------ Ready for the action now, Dangerboy Ready if I'm ready for you, Dangerboy Ready if I want it now, Dangerboy? How dare you, dare you, Dangerboy? How dare you, Dangerboy? I dare you, dare you, Dangerboy...
posted
The "Tribunal" shot is very dark and includes a camera pan - perhaps the scale shouldn't be established from this shot, because the Hideki could be farther off and down than we think?
The craft in "..Wind" was definitely considered a shuttle. It also appeared to be a CGI construct instead of the detailed physical model - AND it seemed to me that its structure was less detailed than that of the regular Hideki CGI model, too. However, the general shape was identical, leaving it unclear whether the VFX people really wanted to show a distinct design.
The "shuttle-Hideki" could be the craft that was intended to reside in the landing bays of Terok Nor before Starfleet took over and parked runabouts in them. The regular Hideki is usually portrayed as too big to fit into the runabout bays - both in the battle scenes where the CGI ship flies close to the station, and in "Profit and Loss" where a Hideki (called a "freighter" here) docks at the docking ring.
The original Hideki model had lots of asymmetric detail that made the ship look like a rusty freighter, which was its intended alias in its first big public appearance, in the said "Profit and Loss". If the Hideki really is a general purpose ship used as a freighter but adopted as an attrition warcraft when matters get desperate, then I can't really accept Defiant roots for the design. If the Cardassians managed to do industrial espionage on the Defiant design, they'd put it into better use than a mere small freighter.
posted
Altair: Do they have a Defiant-class somewhere else as well?
------------------ Ready for the action now, Dangerboy Ready if I'm ready for you, Dangerboy Ready if I want it now, Dangerboy? How dare you, dare you, Dangerboy? How dare you, Dangerboy? I dare you, dare you, Dangerboy...
posted
I think that Hideki shuttle is the fighter that the DS9 TM talks about. I think the Heavy Penetrator is the larger one that is in the fleet scenes. But according to the manual is states that the fighter is produced at 352 ships a year and the heavy penetrator is produced at 443 ships a year. Though this would be nice to know if I didn't think this would be true. Producing more a bigger design than the smaller design does not make much sense.
------------------ Predict the unpredictable, but how do you unpredict the unpredictable?
posted
Rick S. says the heavy penetrator of DS9 TM fame is the Cardie designation for the "dreadnought" missile seen in the Voyager episode of the same name. The design can be flown both manned and unmanned.
There is also at least one unseen but canonically mentioned Cardassian design. VOY "Maneuvers" mentions a Cardassian frigate that was disabled by the Maquis on Bajoran orbit. Perhaps the Hidekis are considered frigates? Or perhaps there is another ship design sized somewhere between Hideki and Galor, waiting to be seen?
posted
The Defiant and Hideki certainly do look quite similar in overall layout. And IIRC they were both designed at roughly the same time by the same person (Jim Martin, late in the DS9 2nd season). I also remember reading somewhere that Martin based his Defiant off a freighter design i.e. the Hideki. Perhaps the Hideki model was never intended to be reused after its initial appearance, but TPTB later changed their minds.
Another thing, I wonder where the bridge of the Hideki-class would be. I would at least think that the bigger Hideki has the bridge in the nose piece - sort of similar to the Galor.
------------------ "Forgive me if I don't share your euphoria!" (Weyoun to Dukat, Tears of the Prophets) Dax's Ships of STAR TREK
posted
The Defiant design apparently indeed was originally intended to be a freighter, but I haven't seen any confirmation of what episode it was intended to appear in. Perhaps it was created as a Cardassian freighter for "Profit and Loss" but abandoned in favor of the Hideki? I'd wager the original intention was to have the bridge in the nosepiece in both the Hideki, the Defiant-freighter, and the actual Defiant.
The Hideki doesn't seem to have much space for cargo, even in its larger forms. Perhaps the aft pincers are intended for towing cargo barges?
posted
Incidentally, there's a full-coverage review of the original photographic model at the starshipmodeler site that includes a ventral shot. A bow shot seems to indicate that the only surface feature that could be a forward-firing weapon is the thing in the middle of the bottom of the "head" of the ship, and indeed this is where the beam weapon is most often seen firing from.
Timo Saloniemi
(I'll be.. I thought I had mastered the fine art of attaching an URL, but apparently THREE edits isn't enough to get all the typos out of the text. I'll go home and sulk the rest of the day.) [This message has been edited by Timo (edited August 11, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Timo (edited August 11, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Timo (edited August 11, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Timo (edited August 11, 2000).]
posted
That is a very nice ship. Would be cool to steal the prints and build it with ivory-like ablative armor and a fast-firing Defiant-node in that cheek-place. Funny, in "Tribunal" the light cascaded on the O'Brien-pursuing Hideki made it look grey-blue and purple, like a Dominion ship. Looked nice. . . . . . .
[Has this message been edited by Timo? Perhaps on August 11, 2000 ??]
posted
Interesting...thanks Timo for the links. That is indeed the website where I saw the photos a long time ago (but lost the bookmark, of course...). It looks kind of like a combination phaser/disruptor/energy cannon emitter of some kind (above) with a photon torpedo tube (below it), which would be consistant with what we've seen in the battle scenes. However, going by the scale, it somehow looks a lot smaller than a ship supposedly holding up to 30 crewmen, and seems quite underarmed to be a Jem Ha'dar "bug" equivalent. Perhaps there really are two size versions? A "fighter" scale version (seen in the photos) equivalent to the Starfleet small tac fighter, and a larger "escort" version (equal to the "bug" in size), with heavier armament, maybe that published in the St: The Magazine article?
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