posted
I'm not sure the Chaplin is such a good idea, traditionally Star Trek has avoided having the Federation or Starfleet involved in any kind of religion. However if you're set on having priests and Padres in Starfleet then you might want to represent a fair cross-section of beliefs and not just the human one's either.
Also, should the Federation naval patrol have a Starfleet communicator?
I like the lightly armoured marine (even though I'm not crazy about the idea of Starfleet marines in the first place) it's a nice way to tie-in the old movie uniforms with the uniforms of the 24th Century.
posted
Reverend: I don't buy the 'no religion in the future' bunk so if people need to fullfill their religious needs, there has to be someone there to facilitate it. I'm also not in the business of being politically correct. I know enough about catholic/anglican stuff to make a 24th century Chaplain uniform. I don't know enough about any other religion to make the same. So I won't bother trying just to keep someone from feeling left out.
Federation Naval Patrol might be part of the combined service, or not. Who knows.
As for the light armor, I like it, but I really would have preferred it was something more sleek looking. Might work on that some more.
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
I'm not saying there is no religion in the future, ,at least as far as Trek is concerned I'm sure there is. In fact I'm almost certain the Sisko quoted the bible at least once.
What I am saying is that I don't think that it's practical for Starfleet to have a service dedicated to providing Religious services. There are literally hundreds of Earth Religions and over 150 Federation worlds, assuming that most worlds have more or less the same number of belief systems that means there would be several thousand, or even tens of thousands of Religions out there. Imagine what it would be like if even a fraction of those religions would have to be represented at a Starbase, or even worse onboard a starship? It's far more likely that it's up to the individual churches, movements, temples, whathaveyou to set up and provide their services wherever they can or wish (within reason) while remaining autonomous from any military or governmental institutions.
To support this I think there is a line in TNG -- I forget the episode but it was on of the "Worf has a crisis of faith" ones -- He basically says that if a person's beliefs interfere with their duty then they have no business being in Starfleet. That can be interpreted in several ways but to me it says that there is a clear separation between organised Religion and the Military.
Personally I couldn't give a monkey's right nut about being politically correct but I do think that it is important to stay true to the ideals of ethnic an cultural diversity that Gene laid down from the start. But like I said if you are dead set on having some religions represented in the services then the least you should do is represent a fair cross-section. You are on the internet and it shouldn't be too difficult to find some appropriate reference materials, even a uniform styled in a similar fashion to one of the various Vulcan priestesses' costumes seen over the years would at least help.
posted
I don't think Reverend's saying there's no religion in the future so much as Star Trek doesn't show either the Federation or Starfleet involved in them. Obviously, there is religion in the future since the original Enterprise had the chapel (seen in "Balance of Terror"), the Vulcans have a religion rituals, and the Bajorans have such a strong faith in higher powers that actually do exist. We've just never seen any of the Starfleet starships carry aboard a chaplin.
Personally, I like the idea of Starfleet having a Religious Corps -- the members of which are stationed throughout Starfleet's facilities and on the larger and deep-space vessels. However, I'd recommend against having every faith have a different uniform. Even though Star Trek does a lousy job showing population diversity, realistically almost every race will have multiple religions. That's gonna be a whole lot of uniforms. Ignore that last part, though, if you were planning on having the pinstripes on the uniform a different color or pattern for each faith.
Very nice work on the new uniform additions, Ahkileez. I like those Starfleet issue exercise suits. Very nice, indeed.
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
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posted
If you follow the Modern Day U.S. Military line of thinking that was the basis for TOS, the various U.S. Services have a chaplin's section that's somewhat separate, but still a strong part of each service. In the services, they wear the same uniform that their unit wears on a daily basis, w/the only exception being that they wear a marking, usually a simple lapel pin like a Cross, Star of David or similar device to mark the religion that they personally worship and are devoted to. However, they are required to be familiar with aspects of all religions, tho not necessarily intimately so. For instance, most Catholic Priests aren't going to be intimately familiar with Islam, but I'll bet you'd be hard-pressed to find one that hasn't read the Koran and has a good understanding of Islam, Judaism, and any number of non-Catholic Christian religions. Chaplins are also looked upon as a sort of couselor by a great many people, regardless the chaplins actual religious beliefs. You can't always have a chaplin of your Faith in your unit, but you can always go and talk to a "Man (or Woman) of the Cloth" about issues regarding religion or morales.
Anyhow, I don't see why StarFleet wouldn't have something very similar to that. After all, they respect a great many things, if only to take it at face value. I think I recall reading about a chaplin in one of the old Star Trek novels, this was before TNG first aired. I know that I'd feel a lot better having someone of The Cloth serving on a ship that is the only think keeping me from dying a horrible death in the deep, dark expanses of space.
Just my random flow of neurons and misfiring of pre-ganglianic nerve endings on the subject....
Registered: Apr 2003
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quote:Chaplins are also looked upon as a sort of couselor by a great many people, regardless the chaplins actual religious beliefs
Exept of course Starfleet vessels tend to have counsllors any way, so wouldn't chaplins be doubling up?
As to the Uniforms, does anybody else think that the black belt on the marine artic uniform stands out to far? Also maybe you could add some pockets for them or do they use some type of webbing to carry their gear?
Also why would the Federation Naval Patrol use the same dress uniform as Starfleet surley they would have thier own uniform type to seprate them form starfleet? Any ideas for their duty uniforms? Swimsuits perhaps?
Registered: May 2001
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posted
The religion in Star Trek/Starfleet debate is really a hot issue. And this probably isn't the venue for it.
However, I do think it's a good point so I'm going to look and see if I can at least see if I can gimick up a Vulcan one.
For the most part, the uniforms would be signatory to the faith of the person in questin (just not overly loaded down with the paraphanalia of that person's personal religion). So a Catholic/Anglican might have the little collar thing, a Jewish one might have the shawl over his shoulders and maybe the cap, a hindu or muslim one might have the turban or something as part of the formal dress, like Scotty wearing his with the kilt. The variations would be small. Just enough to be signatory.
Griffworks does make the point tho, that Chaplains, while 'experts' in their own religion, they are required to be knowledgable about a certain amount of others. (many christian chaplains can read both the Quo'ran and the Torah and perform ceremonies from those religions). And it's not as if you're Hindu you can't benefit from the advise and the strength of faith of a Jewish chaplain for instance.
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
Starfleet would never allow a priest to serve on a galaxy class starship: there are children aboard after all...
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
I walk towards the edge and throw little things off, like car-parts, bottles and cutlery - whatever I find lying around. It's become a habit - a way to start the day.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Very nice! Why does everyone forget the "skant". The unisex skirt featured in season 1 TNG. I'm sure that combined with some of those uniforms would be... interesting.
Heheheh the Arctic Fatigues with Skant!
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
I'm sure that by the 24th Century they've gotten Catholic priests to behave themselves.
I like the "Hazardous Leakage Repair Suit" although you might want to streamline that name a little. Perhaps "HAZMAT Suit" would be a little better.
I still don't think that the Federation Naval Patrol would be a part of Starfleet, it is after all just a global coast guard and has nothing to do with space travel. I'd ditch the Starfleet combadge and give them a more old fashioned flip top or wrist communicator instead. It also might be interesting to see a more practical version of the duty uniform, one that they'd actually wear out to sea. Perhaps something that incorporates a futuristic version of a life jacket and maybe even a baseball cap.
The Vulcan Chaplin is a good start, although I'd be inclined to incorporate the look of the old TNG, long dress uniform only make it look similar the Vulcan robes. Perhaps have the trim line on the chest cross over each other diagonally instead of going straight down? Maybe even incorporate the white and orangey/red colouring of the Monks and Priestesses of Mt Selaya?
quote:Originally posted by Reverend: I'm not terrably keen on them either, but for the coast guard they would have a very practical purpose...unless of course they wore sunglasses.
What about peaked caps, like every navy in the world uses (even the US Navy when they aren't looking like fools in their baseball caps)?
Registered: Jan 2003
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