posted
Well, I'm surprised. I didn't expect the regeneration to happen in this episode. At best, I figured the Doctor would die at the end and the Christmas special would pick up there and show the regeneration.
And it looks like Mark was wrong in the "Bad Wolf" thread. Even though Captain Jack "survived" (that was the end result, anyway), the TARDIS took off without him. So, unless they're going to go back for him, he won't be around next year. But, if they're going to go back for him, what was the point of leaving him behind in the first place?
Overall, though, excellent episode. I kind of hoped the Dalek leader would be Davros, but that's okay. I do wonder, though, whether the Dalek Emperor held that title before he resurrected his species or not. After all, in "Remembrance of the Daleks", the emperor was Davros. So, might he have had successors? Might the other group of Daleks have eventually gotten themselves a lead Dalek who became an emperor? Since the Doctor knew who he was, the implication seems to be that there was a Dalek Emperor already, and this isn't a title he invented after recreating the Daleks. Perhaps the world shall never know.
Also, I just read on the BBC Web site that Rose will be in all 13 episodes of season 2/28 (starting in March), there will be another Christmas special, and then there will be a season 3/29. And: Cybermen!
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
I'll miss Eccleston. Probably my favourite Doctor after Tom Baker.
I was thinking that Tennant is too young to be the Doctor, so I looked up their ages when they started (I think someone else did this, but I was bored). Here's how it roughly works out:
posted
Oh, there was another thing I forgot to mention: I hope they'll decide that the Doctor's overly strong feelings for Rose were a personality quirk of the ninth Doctor. That scene where they kissed was more out-of-place than the one in the movie.
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
Finally saw it - and man, was it incredible. Easily the most fun I've had watching a season of SF in a long time. To sum up my thoughts on the very good, if all too brief, tenure of Chris Eccleston, I'm posting something I posted in another forum:
***
I'm of the opinion that on some level, this incarnation is the Doctor's mid-life crisis... Or his pennance.
I'm not entirely sure how to word it, but somehow I feel comfortable thinking that the Doctor did some really, really horrible things during the Time War, up to and including the destruction of an entire race and the fundamental alteration of many others. Nevermind what the actual cause of the 8th Doctor's regeneration actually was, but I think that mentally, on some level, whatever he did afftected him to the point that this incarnation was almost meant to sum up all the guilt, suffering and anguish he felt during that time, and possibly through all his previous incarnations. Eccleston's fantastic performance at portraying the Doctor as a guilt-ridden, often hate-filled, potentially violent man certainly helped to solidify this supposition for me.
How apt, then, that once the Daleks were revealed to NOT have been destroyed, and then were destroyed by a literal deus ex machina that the Doctor had nothing to do with, that this incarnation could therefore let go of his accumulated pathos and suffering... And what do we get? A clean slate. A fresh face, and a genuine smile from Tennant that to me signified a new beginning for the Doctor that perhaps he's never had since his second incarnation. The ninth Doctor WAS fantastic, but he was temporary, transitory, and necessary; now, the Doctor truely gets back to it.
Mark
PS - Yes, I'm ignoring what the eighth Doctor went through in the EU books and the destruction of this and that. I never read 'em. Nyehhh.
posted
After the finale aired I watched the "Doctor Who confidential" on BBC3, which had an interesting bit of an interview with Russell T. Davies which opened up an interesting possibility. He said that basically he and Christopher Ecclestone wanted to play the Doctor this series as carrying a tremendous amount of guilt, because whatever it was that wiped out the Daleks and the Time Lords, they basically understood that it was the Doctor who pushed the button. He ended (or thought he ended) the Time War, but he wiped out both sides doing so.
Which opens up a whole new question - did he take that action with the permission of the Time Lords? They might, after all, have decided to make that sacrifice in order to take the Daleks with them. Or did the Doctor do it on his own initiative? Was it a mistake, or did he know that pushing the button (or whatever he did) would wipe out his own people, but also save the universe from the Daleks?
Didn't the fat conspiracy theory guy in episode one mention something about the ninth Doctor being washed up on the coast of Java? Perhaps the closing act of the time war killed the Doctor and triggered his regeneration. After all if Daleks could "fall through time" and survive maybe he did too.
Oh, one other thing came out of the interview: according to Davies the Time Lords started the war: he linked it back to "Genesis of the Daleks" and said that no matter what they might say, the Time Lords were the aggressors in the war. Interesting stuff, especially as the tendency of the viewer is to immediately empathise with the Doctor and see the Daleks as the unreasonable ones.
I do agree with you Mark, in that the 9th Doctor seemed to be plagued by his memories of the Time War, but he also managed to see it brought to a full and complete close. Hopefully the 10th will be a little more able to enjoy himself and won't give the impression that he's running from something.
-------------------- Quidquid latine dictum sit altum viditur
Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by TSN: Oh, there was another thing I forgot to mention: I hope they'll decide that the Doctor's overly strong feelings for Rose were a personality quirk of the ninth Doctor. That scene where they kissed was more out-of-place than the one in the movie.
OK let me just say - oh for fuck's sake... The kiss was brilliant! The episode was brilliant! The Series was BRILLIANT! When the kiss happened - I just smirked to myself (all of 5 minutes ago) - I thought NYAH! That will stick it to those dweebs who thought the Kiss in the movie was 'out of character' and 'out of place' and 'not a Doctor-like thing to do' etc. PUH-LEASE! These two have gone through life and death and life and death and life together and he for a split second found another person - who shared with him how he lived everyday (seeing all of time and space and all possibilites etc.) - they HAD to do it and it was just - just - wonderful.
I loved the whole thing.
I too now miss Eccleston - he was a fantastic Doctor and played him to a T up until his last breath.
David Tennent looks a bit... wet? I shouldn't say that - I'll end up eating my words.
So, Kiss-nay-sayers - if you didn't like that - what the HELL did you think of Cap'n Jack's kiss with the Doctor? Must be messing your pants?
All was good in this episode and this series. Nice to hear they managed to get Billie Piper back for the rest of the second season! Oh and not including "The Christmas Invasion" - MARCH!! That's WAY too long to wait!
Loved it.
Andrew
P.S. Just now waiting to see TSN's comments about my frantic writing style in various threads for the next year or so. Subtle as a Dalek.
Andrew
P.P.S. Loved the silent *blink* *blink* - *blink* *blink* of the Dalek outside the window of Linda-with-an-'i'.
Andrew
P.P.P.S. What year was the 4th great and bountiful human civilisation supposed to be? 150,000? That puts into frame when the Humans first officially met the Daleks - as the guy who one the Weakest Link knew of them and knew they had gone. BTW, Was Jack from the 51st century?
Andrew
P.P.P.P.S.
Also loved the "You are the weakest link" and the destruction of the Dalek. Did they make that a weapon or was the Dalek just "beamed" away with that transmat?
Andrew (Bring back Eccleston)
P.P.P.P.P.S. I wonder if they could ever do a "Seven Doctors" with Tom, Peter, Colin, Sylvester, Paul, Christopher and David?
Andrew
P.P.P.P.P.P.S.
OK, now having calmed down a bit after my rather hasty post - Mark... Fawndoo - both of your posts were fabulous elloquent and thought-provoking.
I really like your theory there Mark - and what you said at the end about being a Doctor that was temporary and transitional but necessary - sound right on the money and makes it easier to deal with Eccleston going so soon. He has really left his mark in Doctor Who history.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Eccleston accomplished what he wanted, which was to break his typecasting in only serious roles AND going out on top with fans clamoring in vain for more. IMO he could have still done this having done two years, but...
quote:Originally posted by FawnDoo: After the finale aired I watched the "Doctor Who confidential" on BBC3, which had an interesting bit of an interview with Russell T. Davies which opened up an interesting possibility. He said that basically he and Christopher Ecclestone wanted to play the Doctor this series as carrying a tremendous amount of guilt, because whatever it was that wiped out the Daleks and the Time Lords, they basically understood that it was the Doctor who pushed the button. He ended (or thought he ended) the Time War, but he wiped out both sides doing so.
Which opens up a whole new question - did he take that action with the permission of the Time Lords? They might, after all, have decided to make that sacrifice in order to take the Daleks with them. Or did the Doctor do it on his own initiative? Was it a mistake, or did he know that pushing the button (or whatever he did) would wipe out his own people, but also save the universe from the Daleks?
So that he was seeing things were basically going to happen again in the same way in the episode, but in the end didn't? That's an interesting idea...
Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged
"So, Kiss-nay-sayers - if you didn't like that - what the HELL did you think of Cap'n Jack's kiss with the Doctor? Must be messing your pants?"
Except, Jack kissed the Doctor. Not the other way around.
"What year was the 4th great and bountiful human civilisation supposed to be? 150,000? That puts into frame when the Humans first officially met the Daleks - as the guy who one the Weakest Link knew of them and knew they had gone."
As explicitly stated in each episode, "The Long Game" was in the year 200 000 and "Bad Wolf" (and, by extension, "The Parting of the Ways") was in the year 200 100. The Daleks visited Earth previously in the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, and 2160s at the very least. (Though, that last one may have ceased to have happened after "Genesis of the Daleks").
"I wonder if they could ever do a 'Seven Doctors' with Tom, Peter, Colin, Sylvester, Paul, Christopher and David?"
Obviously McGann would be easy. I expect they could pull off Davison and McCoy with enough makeup. But have you seen what the Bakers look like these days? No way.
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Oh i've added an addition to my post while you were posting your post Mark... it mentions you.
Gawrsh, I'm all blushy and stuff now.
Anyone under the impression that the Doctor was actively trying to hold off the regenerative process, so he can properly say goodbye to Rose? I think that his personality helped more than anything else... What a guy.
posted
As long as he doesn't suddenly call Rose "Spanners".
He seemed to indicate that he was somehow preparing himself for regeneration (I hope that doesn't mean we won't get post-regeneration wackiness), but You could be right. Maybe he had already done that, and he was holding himself together just long enough for Rose to wake up. It would certainly explain why the regeneration's timing was so dramatically perfect.
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
While I'm at it, I've got the feeling that at least part of Tennant's first line was re-dubbed. When he said "BAW-celona", it almost certainly looked like that's not the way he originally said it. Given that Tennant's a Scot, I wonder if he delievered his first line as such but was considered either too thick, or too McCoy.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic
