posted
A kitten really - no not like that - there were a couple of kittens that live(d) across the street. I ended up feeding them after the hurricane.
Anyhow, we were going to see Wallace and Gromit tonight and the little orange male ran behind the car. I of course didn't see him. He died right in front of us.
We had been trying to get his owner to realize that there are simply to many cars in our neighbor hood for outdoor cats - but I didn't expect to be the culprit.
Next moral question - do I steal the sister kitten and raise her safely inside?
-------------------- Twee bieren tevreden, zullen mijn vriend betalen.
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posted
When I was younger, my dad ran over one of our cats. She was an outdoor cat, and she decided to nap one afternoon in the shadow of the back tire. He didn't see her there and didn't know he had even driven over anything at the time. It's a horrible feeling to know you've accidentally killed a pet.
Before you steal the sister kitten, can you ask that owner if you can adopt her from him or her? If you were still feeding them when the brother kitten died, maybe the owner would be happy to turn her over to you (especially if they were both outdoor cats to begin with). I don't know if stealing is such a good idea; if that little kitten decides to sit in the window, the neighbor will know you've got his or her cat.
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
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posted
I agree, stealing the kitten outright is probably not the best first option, but I also am of the opinion that there are very few communities in this country that are safe for outdoor cats these days, and it's inhumane to let cats out. Especially if they're kittens and inexperienced and unknowning of possible dangers.
Good luck, and try not to beat yourself up about it too much... if you didn't see him, there's nothing you could've done.
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
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Call the Humane Society is the owner does not give you the kiten and you see it outdoors again.
They dont euthanise kittens or puppies- someone always adopts them, after all, and you'll bedoing it a favor.
Outdoor cats are prone to all kinds of disease and the owner has probably not made any investment in shots for the kitten(s) if he's got them living outdoors.
One of my kith (step-uncle?) killed my little cousin's cat on a cold winter morning in Gainsville- it was an "outdoor cat" and had climed into his car's motor for warmth...
Very Bad scene when he started up the car for work early the next morning. Turns out there is a service for pet disposal in gainsville and they showed up at 5am, cleaned up (most of) the mess and he just told my cousin the cat ran away or something.
That's my cat-related horror story for the day.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
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"...it's inhumane to let cats out."
And how inhumane was it that we domesticated them?
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quote:And how inhumane was it that we domesticated them?
When did we domesticate them, I thought they just mooched from us?
-------------------- "and none of your usual boobery." M. Burns
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Teh PW
Self Impossed Exile (This Space for rent)
Member # 1203
posted
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Call the Humane Society is the owner does not give you the kiten and you see it outdoors again.
They dont euthanise kittens or puppies- someone always adopts them, after all, and you'll bedoing it a favor.
Outdoor cats are prone to all kinds of disease and the owner has probably not made any investment in shots for the kitten(s) if he's got them living outdoors.
One of my kith (step-uncle?) killed my little cousin's cat on a cold winter morning in Gainsville- it was an "outdoor cat" and had climed into his car's motor for warmth...
Very Bad scene when he started up the car for work early the next morning. Turns out there is a service for pet disposal in gainsville and they showed up at 5am, cleaned up (most of) the mess and he just told my cousin the cat ran away or something.
That's my cat-related horror story for the day.
i heard of a story about a cat that was inside a A/M32C-17 Air Conditioner some place on a det in the lower Middle east, evidently sitting inside of the big drive belts for the compressor. they started it up and heard thumps inside the metal skin as kitty parts hit all the insides...
still pretty bad (i know, i would have been heart broken if that occured to me, the accidental offing a pet...)
quote:Originally posted by Cartman: "...it's inhumane to let cats out."
And how inhumane was it that we domesticated them?
The simple fact is that today's cats may be equipped to survive outside, but there are so many dangers in Human-inhabited areas (cars, notably) that it's not fair to them, when they still rely on us to a certain extent for food and shelter. Hell, the domestic shorthair cat is descended directly from the Egyptian shorthair, and that's a very warm climate. Even with the fur, cats require warm temperatures. Therefore, domesticating cats isn't nearly as bad as semi-domesticating them and bringing them to a non-native climate.
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WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
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I used to work part time for a sign painter off and on. He lived on a rural road where truckers typically eschewed the constraints of speed limits. I would do some work for him for a couple of weeks then wouldn't have any work for a couple months. Every time I came back there would be a "new" pet for his kids. The last having received an appropriate burial. I asked him why he didn't close the fence surrounding his acre lot.
He said: "Ah, its cruel to fence them in." and a few weeks later there would be another "new" pet.
I just don't get it.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
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quote:Originally posted by Cartman: "...it's inhumane to let cats out."
And how inhumane was it that we domesticated them?
The simple fact is that today's cats may be equipped to survive outside, but there are so many dangers in Human-inhabited areas (cars, notably) that it's not fair to them, when they still rely on us to a certain extent for food and shelter. Hell, the domestic shorthair cat is descended directly from the Egyptian shorthair, and that's a very warm climate. Even with the fur, cats require warm temperatures. Therefore, domesticating cats isn't nearly as bad as semi-domesticating them and bringing them to a non-native climate.
yeah- I see an old woman waking her Alaskan Huskey all the time.
Not much use for sled dogs down this way.
Cats are just as domesticated (fucked) as dogs- I've seen many cats petrified of anything outdoors.
Like cows, most of their species would die out without us.
[ October 08, 2005, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: Jason Abbadon ]
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
Dogs are more adaptable to cold climates on their own, whereas the species that domestic cats are descended from are strictly warm-climate creatures -- so dogs (and relatives, like wolves) are more at home in colder climates... assuming there's no human dangers otherwise. That's the key. I still hold by the original claim (and Toadkiller's opinion, I believe) that the main reason it's inhumane to let a pet outdoors is because there's the high risk of the pet being painfully killed or maimed by human activity.
Like in WizArtist's story, it's more inhumane to let them get flattened on the roadway because you're too busy to keep constant watch over the animals. If you let them out (without a leash), you've got to watch them like you watch kids: constantly.
As far as cats being afraid of the outdoors, that is purely a result of individual upbringing and early experiences. Our older cats are strays that we brought in when they were each a year or two old, and they still want to get out from time to time. (We let them, but only under direct supervision, and during the warm months.) The younger cats were adoped from a shelter at eight weeks old (and they'd been inside for a few weeks before that, too), and they rarely show an interest in going outdoors. We also had a fairly neurotic cat named Chessie, who died of kidney failure a few years ago (at nine years old); she was actually born indoors and never expressed an interest in going outdoors, ever. But that's simply because she was born inside and the outdoors was an unfamiliar environment.
As long as a family is able to continue supporting their pets, there's simply no reason against keeping them indoors and domesticating them further. It's more cruel to leave them in danger outside, because although cats are plenty capable of taking care of themselves in the wild (assuming they're raised in the wild and are taught the necessary skills by their mothers), the simple fact is that humanity has spread across the entire planet like a cancer, and the cities and suburbs are no place for them, and even rural areas, with the highways and hi-speed roads running through it, aren't that safe.
Or are you guys arguing that humanity should never have domesticated cats and dogs in the first place? If that's your argument, then I'll just stop now, because there's no point in arguing over something that happened nine thousand years ago.
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posted
I would not argue over potential mistakes that happened that long ago, but to further domesticate a species via inbreeding and selective breeding (usually to get some weak "miniature" version) is pretty fucking wrong.
Ever see a mini-Doberman? They're pathetic, tiny, have a host of serious inbred medical ailments and still have all the instincts and reactions of a large dog.
Not exactly the keys to a happy life.
Cats get the same treatment- a desired look is maintained by controlled inbreeding- sometimes at the loss of half an adverage litter because of defects (it's why Siamese cats are getting more rare, less inteligent and more expensive with each year).
It's survival of the least fit, while the stronger (uglier) mixed breeds end up in the incinerator.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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Ahh, I never thought of that. And I do agree that "purebred" breeding of pets is silly and pointless and vain. But then, every single feline pet I've had contact with has been a common American shorthair, and an adopted stray at that. (Either directly brought in, or picked up from a shelter.)
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
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![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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