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The technologies involved in basic warp flight are much more complicated than just firing excited plasma through verterium cortenide coils (or spools) (or something to that effect). A list of things that must have been available to Cochrane (and which he likely did not invent himself):
SIF The Phoenix could have had at least a crude SIF system to keep her intact during her flight, although it is is not entirely necessary, since the structure can supprt itself and it was only one flight.
IDF The Phoenix definitely needed IDF. Whithout IDF, everyone would've been reduced to mush.
Bussard ramscoops While not necessary to warp flight (it is only used for fuel replenishment), the Phoenix was clearly outiftted with two 'Buzzard' scoops.
Antimatter $ $ "Friendship One" allegedly confirmed that Auntie Matter was used aboard the early warp ships, although fusion power seems more realistic for this age.
Artifical gravity Did the Phoenix have gravity, or was the crew strapped in their chairs? Hard to judge, IIRC.
NavDef I guess the P must have had at least some kind of forcefield to survive a FTL particle collision.
FTL sensors Did the Phoenix have sensors?
If Cochrane didn't invent these things, who did? I'd say the Third World War was instrumental in the development of all these exotic things. Wartime is often a good time for scientific development (see Einstein and his H-bomb idea). Anti-grav tanks? Extreme aircraft with IDF? Forcefields? AM powered facilities? I'd vote yes.
------------------ "Fuck L Ron Hubbard and fuck all his clones. Fuck all those gun-toting hip gangster wannabes." -Tool, Ænima
posted
It could also be that those genetically engineered supermen from the 1990s spent their off hours designing this supertech. I don't know (or really care) if there was an Eugenics War or not - but if there was, perhaps big and important nations made use of the surviving supermen in their more fantastic R&D programs, the way they used Nazi scientists after WWII?
Also, one never knows what USAF really learned from inspecting Quark's Treasure... Perhaps some of its technology was released for use in the 21st century when it began to seem as if it was needed to combat the most advanced tech of other nations? Perhaps other similar visitors traveling through time or space provided technology to select Earth nations without the matter becoming public knowledge? Some of Starling's minions might have made use of the technology of the Aeon after the death of their boss, too - assuming all these things even took place in the same timeline!
About antimatter vs. fusion drives: perhaps fusion was used for manned ships, giving them inferior performance but superior safety when compared with antimatter-powered unmanned probes?
posted
Still calculating the amount of antimatter required for a Phoenix warp flight - how many seconds? I doubt that it is very much at all - a magnetic thermos bottle of a few grams would probably suffice.
Don't worry too much about radiation exposure - only a few seconds flight - and the hull is titanium - fairly dense regarding radiation - and non-magnetic.
Regarding inertial damping fields - are they required? or does the vessel - wrapped within the warp field, accelerate the contents of the field (vessel and organics) simultaneously. I mean, are we talking several g's - or in crossing the warp threshold (a "instantaneous jump I believe) - maybe there is no time in which to experience any acceleration.
Likewise structural integrity fields. The hull is titanium - one of the strongest alloys available at this time - not likely to fail
------------------ Faster than light - no left or right.
posted
Why do I feel like I'm repeating myself...?
We can create antimatter now. Cochrane certainly could have it. The problem is that matter/antimatter reactions result in HUGE MASSIVE LARGE EXPLOSIONS THAT BLOW YOU UP!!! Thus, the reason Trek invented dilithium. Without that, you can't use M/A reactions as a useful source of power.
The "Friendship-1" or whatever (haven't seen the ep yet) was apparently launched a few years after Cochrane's flight. Humans hooked up w/ the Vulcans one day after that flight. Hence, there was plenty of time for Eartn to gain new technologies between Cochrane's flight and the probe launch.
Now that that rant's done...
Botany Bay and Birdseye both had artificial gravity in the 1990s, and it doesn't seem to have been generated by conventional means (i.e. spinning), so, presumably, the Phoenix could easily have had artificial gravity. Also, since I expect the inertial dampers and artificial gravity generators work on the same basic principles, the fact that the Phoenix had an IDF isn't odd, either.
The Bussard collectors do seem strange, especially since they aren't all that effective. Perhaps it wass part of a secondary experiment. Cochrane figured, if the warp flight worked, he could also test the ramscoops at the same time.
------------------ "Although, from what I understand, having travelled around the Mid-west quite a bit, apparently Jesus is coming, so I guess the choice now is we should decide whether we should spit or swallow." -Maynard James Keenan
posted
The IDF field was NOT needed in the Phoenix. Remember, the were subject to acceleration forces when they took off. Also, they accelerated to near "critical velocity" BEFORE engaging warp drive. They would have had to accelerate to almost the speed of light so as not to be crushed when making the jump. That's why they did that.
Otherwise they could've done it standing still.
------------------ "The sons of the Prophet were valiant and bold, And quite unacustomed to fear. But, of all, the most reckless, or so I am told, Was Abdulah Boul Boul Ameer." Aban's Illustration www.alanfore.com
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Pardon me Aban, but you said that the Pheonix accelerated to near light speed before making the jump? Do you KNOW how fast they'd have to be going to reach near light speed? If they were going that fast and accelerated to near c in the timeframe depicted, they WOULD be crushed by the mounting g forces. Consider:
C = 300,000 kps.
"near" c = say 150,000 kps, just to be conservative.
That value = 540,000,000 kph.
To accelerate from speed while in Earth orbit, which is approximately 22,300 mph (if I remember correctly) to 540,000,000 kph in less than ten minutes would create MASSIVE, INTENSE, g-forces. And that's only half the speed of light. I think you'd need an IDF generator.
posted
P.S., could someone explain to me how fusion generators would create the plasma required to pass through the nacelles?
Registered: Nov 2000
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Any high-temperature ionized gas is by definition a plasma. The gas within a deuterium fusion reactor would be helium and leftover deuterium - plasma.
Hmmm, maybe it makes sense for Phoenix to be fusion powered? It would explain the need for bussard collectors.
By the way - they merely mentioned that they had to accelerate to "critical velocity" - I don't think they said what it was.
------------------ Faster than light - no left or right.
Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343
posted
Perhaps "critical velocity" was actually the escape velocity needed to leave Earth's gravity well...although if that were the case, I don't know why they wouldn't just merely say "escape velocity," but... :::shrugs:::
------------------ "I'm beginning to think that there'll be NO forced mating at ALL!" --Professor Hubert T. Farnsworth
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No, they never explained what "critical velocity" was. Escape velocity from the Earth's gravity well makes sense though, because wouldn't it be dangerous to employ a high level warp field near already-warped space?
Registered: Nov 2000
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P.S. Another concern. When did they invent REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY small fusion generators? Do you think it possible by 2260?
Registered: Nov 2000
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Why does everyone keep forgetting that warp drive is non-Newtonian. That is, there are NO INERTIAL FORCES ACTING ON THE OCCUPANTS OF A SHIP THAT GOES TO WARP. It's been over a decade since I first saw that and not a YEAR goes by that someone dredges up the inertial vs. non-inertial argument...
--Jonah
------------------ "It's obvious I'm dealing with a moron..."
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Dr. Emmett Brown had a garbage-powered Mr. Fusion on the back of his DeLorean in 2025.
Back to Trek. The admittedly non-canon SciTech poster of Phoenix shows a fusion tokamak (donut). The fact that governments are now working on fusion suggests that at least some people think fusion power is within reach. Whether the reactors will be small enough to be launched on a missile is a big question. However, I think we'll have fusion reactors long before we have antimatter reactors.
------------------ When you're in the Sol system, come visit the Starfleet Museum
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