posted
So, they've test fired missiles (with some success) to make clear that they....er.... want the US and UN to give them money not to?
Yeah.
Why do I get the feeling Kim sounds a lot like Cobra Commander?
North Korea's econemy in in the crapper, so the government spends all it's available money on military buildup and wants the rest of the world to feed it's people...not a great strategy, IMHO.
I was watching a CNN interview with a former CIA head, saying that while the US will probably return to (pre-1999) UN sanctions, the impact will not really hurt or sway NK's policies and undermining Kim's government could cause a general governmental collapse, leading to an inevitable campaign to re-unify Korea (at the cost of hundreds of billions of dollars) and could lead to someone even more unstable in charge of NK's 8-12 (guesstimated) nuclear warheads.
Speculation/opinions on this crazyness?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
I was just watching an incredible documentary on NK (on CNN) with lots of actual footage filmed by dissidents (who risked death smuggling it out of the country). Footage of soldiers going from village to village executing anyone caught (or accused of) helping people leave "paradise".
Other footage shows bodies left to rot in the street from that famine that "never happened" (according to Kim's government) and UN supplied food aid being sold in black markets after all the food aid organizations were ordered out of the country.
...then it was interrupted by breaking news of NK launching another missile into the sea of Japan. (4:45 a.m. or so) Bringing the total confirmed launches to six so far.
How do you have diplomacy with a country that only has extortion as a bargaining tool?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
I read one article where they say that NK launching those missiles actually BROUGHT the Six-Nation talks back together which had ACTUALLY stalled due to SK and JPN territorial disagreements. An 'expert' on foreign affairs thinks that they should get back on the talks because the NK regieme is failing and we don't want them to perform any last ditch desperate acts like using nuclear or chemical weapons.
I think there is a point in this - NK aren't going to go "Hey guys let's get back to it" directly - but use the missile launching as sort of a person banging loudly on a drum or something to get people to listen.
Anyone read recently that Kim Jong Il's son was spotted in France at an Eric Clapton concert... supposedly he likes the Western lifestyle and is a big Clapton fan.
Of Course Kim Jong Il is supposed to be a big movie buff. I wonder what he thought of Team America!?!
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:An 'expert' on foreign affairs thinks that they should get back on the talks because the NK regieme is failing and we don't want them to perform any last ditch desperate acts like using nuclear or chemical weapons.
So the free world is supposed to prop up the world's last Stalinistic communist regime?
Hmmm....I think it would be better to just officially take DPRK at it's word: they live in paradise and have no economic crisis and no famine and all their citizens want nothing to do with the evils of the outside world and want to be left alone. Then just leave them alone- take no provocative measures, offer no aid (as they offically dont need any) and let them come to the negotiating table for once.
After all, it's not like they'll ever give up their nuclear arms, no matter how much cash they milk out of the rest of the world, and it's very likely that Iran is watching this tantrum for cues on how to make the world bend over.
...but it's been a long night and I'm not feeling charitable just now- I'm sure that after a good six hours of sleep, I'll remember the millions of North Koreans that just want to live in peace and not, you know...die of starvation or warfare.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
This is why I keep insisting that we should have paid attention to this hotspot rather than Iraq. Now we're in a pretty tight situation. We should have invaded NK long ago.
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: For interest's sake... what kind of Regime exists in Burma? It's communist - but not Stalinist?
Military dictatorship since 1962, but with significant economic control. They were previously socialists, but there's recently been a small degree of economic liberalisation. Mostly out of necessity as the 'Burmese way to Socialism' virtually destroyed the economy, which was one of the strongest in Asia at the time of independance. The government (State Peace and Development Council) has charming slogans like "the armed forces and the people, cooperate and crush all those harming the union."
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
The government of Burma decided one day last November to move its capital 320 km north from the previous capital, Yangon, to the city of Naypyidaw.
WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
posted
If you give the bully your milk money, you'll KEEP giving the bully your milk money. I believe Chamberlain (Neville not Wilt) proved that appeasement doesn't work.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343
posted
Kim Jong-Il's Livejournal. I guess all these stupid speeches are keeping him from making entries.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Saltah'na: We should have invaded NK long ago.
I don't think that would've been feasible. The DPRK commands the largest army in the world in terms of manpower; regardless of their capabilities or readiness, nuclear weapons, and long-range striking capabilities, the fact remains that they've got a million-plus guys with guns sitting a few dozen miles from Seoul, one of the economic capitals of the Far East and a very populated region.
As it stands, there's probably barely enough armament in the region to hold back a determined North Korean invasion (in the short term), much less to launch an invasion. And if we built up a lot of troops to prepare for an obvious invasion, the North Koreans would've been able to launch a preemptive strike of their own and make an incredible mess of things.
And this says nothing of the South Koreans' wishes. They're still doggedly trying their own "Sunshine Diplomacy" strategy to gradually lure the North Koreans out of their shell. Everything I've read suggests they'd be dead set against any military action.
quote:I'm sure that after a good six hours of sleep, I'll remember the millions of North Koreans that just want to live in peace and not, you know...die of starvation or warfare.
As much as I hate to say it, the logic that says we must intervene in North Korea is the same logic which should be saying we must intervene in Darfur, and Chechnya, and Pakistan, and the Congo, and Indonesia, and...
At this stage, the least bloody thing we can probably do is completely cut off aid to North Korea, and tell them they can either act civilized or be left to their own devices. Their country is a crisis of their own making (the government, I mean). The fact is that all of the aid we've been providing so far has done nothing but continue to prop up the Communist dictatorship. So while it'll still be a humanitarian crisis in the short run, it'll probably be the least violent course of action over the long run.
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
Registered: Nov 2000
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Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
I agree. Starve em.
Okay, so I sound a bit harsh, but I have more contempt for NK as well as the US's handling of the situation, and considering that the US essentially used false pretenses and "the war on Terrorism" (not to mention their quest for oil) as an excuse to invade Iraq. Had NK had any oil of any kind, the US wouldn't allow NK to get this far.
My support for an invasion of NK is much stronger than Iraq probably because I actually see NK as a threat, not an excuse to beat up on someone.
-------------------- "And slowly, you come to realize, it's all as it should be, you can only do so much. If you're game enough, you could place your trust in me. For the love of life, there's a tradeoff, we could lose it all but we'll go down fighting...." - David Sylvian FreeSpace 2, the greatest space sim of all time, now remastered!
Registered: Mar 1999
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343
posted
A threat to what, the global supply of kimchi?
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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