posted
In the words of a great engineer, I hate temporal mechanics .
But I don't think the prophets went back in time to alter Sisko's life after they met him in the wormhole. I think a more likely explanation is that the prophets were "playing dumb" in a sense when they first met Sisko, pretending for his benefit that they didn't understand his concepts of linear time and so on. These beings live outside of time, and so can see the entire future and past, and apparently have this plan all laid out, a plan which required Sisko to think that this was the first contact the prophets had had outside the celestial temple. The very existence of the orbs, I believe, demonstrated that the prophets had knowledge of the regular universe when they first met Sisko. And after all, Siskos very existence required the interference of the prophets in the life of his mother, so they must have known about him before he made the first trip into the wormhole, otherwise he wouldn't have existed.
------------------ "But, it was so artistically done." -Grand Admiral Thrawn
[This message has been edited by Chimaera (edited July 19, 1999).]
posted
You're being far too linear. From our point of view, sure, Sisko was born before he contacted the Prophets. But not from theirs.
Remember, in the immortal words of M. Doughty "You say correlation is not causation."
------------------ "We kid around a lot about people who are cyclopses, but seriously; if you're a mythic figure you've got challenges that no one should have to deal with." -- John Flansburgh
posted
Bah! But then how is it possible he existed if he contacted them first and then was born...?
I think I've just either confused myself or let Sol confuse me...
------------------ Elim Garak: "Oh, it's just Garak. Plain, simple Garak. Now, good day to you, Doctor. I'm so glad to have made such an... interesting new friend today." (DS9: "Past Prologue")
posted
Well, the Prophets can't know everything that's going to happen before it happens. If that were true, then they would have known who would have won the Reckoning (or rather, that it wouldn't take place as previously scheduled. Hang on. The Reckoning hasn't taken place yet. Kost Amojan will need a new vessel. Sounds like a plot for a movie...), and their conversation with Sisko in Emmisary would have been like "Hey, Sisko. You're wife's dead. Get over it. We love baseball, too. You can use the wormhole, but for now, get out." Thus, unless they're playing dumb, some other being more powerful than the Prophets (possibly future versions of the Prophets?) set up this causality loop. Or maybe certain Prophets, such as Sarah, know about The Sisko and linear time, while others, possibly lower in some sort of hierarchy, don't, and were the ones we encountered on most occasions.
So here we have three possibilities: More powerful entities set up a causality loop; The Prophets played dumb; Some of the Prophets actually don't know what's going on, while others do. Any others?
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"It was an accident, officer. I was cleaning my fingernails. With a hunting knife. And he ran into me. Backwards. Fourteen times." - B. Hill
posted
I honestly don't see any problem here...the Prophets don't experience time in the same way we do.
------------------ "We kid around a lot about people who are cyclopses, but seriously; if you're a mythic figure you've got challenges that no one should have to deal with." -- John Flansburgh
posted
I think the problem here is that halfway through the series (or more like two thirds or three quarters through the series) somebody got a great idea about what to do with the prophets and Sisko as emissary. Problem was, it didn't quite fit well with what had been done before. Same as with the Klingon forhead. This sort of thing happens when the entire series is not planned out from day one. Hell, it happens when the entire series is planned out (I've seen a number of inconsistencies in B5, for instance). But didn't someone ask one of the writers on a chat once about it?
The "prophets play dumb for Sisko's benefit" explanation is the one I think works the best. But that's just my unqualified opinion, it's too early to argue temporal mechanics.
------------------ "But, it was so artistically done." -Grand Admiral Thrawn
posted
Minor $polier I guess if you haven't seen the episodes I'm talking about.
I watched "Destiny" last nite, the episode where they set up a communications relay in the Gamma Quadrant. In it, events of Trakor's prophesy start comining true and Kira suggest that the Prophets, being non-linear, could of known the events first then tell Trakor so he could make the prophesy.
In the end of the episode Sisko is talking to the Vedak about another prophesy regarding the Emissary saying, "The Emissary will face a fiery trial where he must choose..." and cut off there. This brings up two suggestions, either he predicted The Reckoning, where he'd have to choose the life of his son in order to defeat the Pah-Wraiths and give Bajor peace and prosperity. Or it could of been a prediction of "What You Leave Behind" and Sisko's battle with Dukat in the Fire Caves, hense the fiery part of the prediction.
This seems to go along with the possiblity of DS9 being a causality paradox as well.
------------------ Elim Garak: "Oh, it's just Garak. Plain, simple Garak. Now, good day to you, Doctor. I'm so glad to have made such an... interesting new friend today." (DS9: "Past Prologue")
posted
The only thing I can think of is that Prophets had planned on creating Sisko. When they did they didn't know where they put him in the timeline since time wasn't known to them. When Sisko told them who he was they then found out where it was they had put him. (I know, this is confusing me)
I'm saying they put him in a place, but they didn't know when in history. Get that?
------------------ It's all about the Pentiums, Baby!
posted
I know. I didn't like the hierarchy idea much, either, but it would explain things. Even the Q have a chain-of-command, of sorts.
I like the theory about the prophets not knowing when they put Siskor. When Sarah-prophet left the temple to inhabit Ben's mother, she would have discovered linear time, if only by her joining with Ben's mother. But she never returned to the temple until Shadows and Symbols, so she couldn't tell the other Prophets. Still doesn't explain the causality loop, though.
Unrelated theory: the Prophets do exist in our time, but never sensed it until Sisko showed up, as it imposes no limitations on them.
Topic Closed
From our point of view, sure, Sisko was born before he contacted the Prophets. But not from theirs.
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