posted
I was simply wondering why the Star Trek Animated Series is generally regarded as non-canon? Admittedly, I have seen very little of it, and as such, I certainly have no position on whether it should or should not be considered canon.
Is it because the stories contradict other events in Star Trek? Is it simply because it is a cartoon? I have read that Roddenberry supposedly regretted certain aspects of TAS, but I have no idea what those aspects are.
-------------------- “My experience with Rick Berman is, you know, he does not understand what he's doing, he does not understand science fiction.” -- Andrew Probert
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
Giant Spock clones. The Enterprise carrying around a giant blow-up Enterprise-shaped balloon. And other assorted moments of pain.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
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posted
Much like TOS itself was a moment of pain, really. B)
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
I think giant me-shaped balloons would be cool. I could set them loose in my town and frighten the humble villagers into serving me without question.
Maybe then, the chick that works at Roadsters on Friday night would give me a second look...
Clones of me on the other hand would be difficult to manage. I, along with most other people, can barely stand one of myself.
Sorry, what were we talking about?
Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
Was the ballon-Ent's really from TAS? I thought that was original to the How Much for Just the Planet novel.
Not that it matters I suppose.
To answer the question - the powers thought the production values and writing was bad so they'd just as soon forget it. Others disagree.
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Registered: Oct 2000
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Teh PW
Self Impossed Exile (This Space for rent)
Member # 1203
posted
quote:Originally posted by Toadkiller: Was the ballon-Ent's really from TAS? I thought that was original to the How Much for Just the Planet novel.
Not that it matters I suppose.
To answer the question - the powers thought the production values and writing was bad so they'd just as soon forget it. Others disagree.
Look at who the target audience was when TAS was made, too. That was a factor as well really. Mature story telling in animation didn't start to occur until Space Battleship Yamato came to the states as Star Blazers (a stretch, i know but it was hella better than Super Friends )... Though im told they actually aired Kimba and Astroboy in the late 60's and early 70's in the states as well. I wasn't a active TV viewer until the late 70's from what i recall
posted
I have all of the episodes on DVD-R, haven't watched them all yet, but I have them.
First off, TAS comprises of like 1�% of all 700+ hours of Star Trek on video. That number is so incredibly insiginificant that it really shouldn't matter if it is canon or not. Nevertheless, I like to think of it as canon just for the shock value, I suppose.
It is, afterall "Star Trek", it is on TV, and it is the real actors playing thier previously established characters, so it seems in that aspect it is really no different than the core of what makes TOS, TNG, DS9, etc canon.
On the flip side you have the fact that it is aimed at kids and it's a cartoon, other than that and some of the outrageous stories/visuals the pros seem to outweigh the cons for me.
Thinking back to some of the outrageous/far-fetched aspects of TOS in say "The Changeling", "Spocks Brain", "Catspaw", "ST-V" off the top of my head, TAS could have done better, but it also produced enough interesting stories or continuation of stories to catch the (so called) canon eye of Futurama Guy.
What comes to mind are say: "Yesteryear", "More Troubles, More Tribbles", "Time Trap", "Slaver Weapon", "One of Our Planets is Missing", "The Counter-Clock Incident", and to a lesser degree "Mudd's Passion" and "The Pirates of Orion" all fill in holes or add aspects to previously established characters/aliens that are almost too fun to ignore, kind of like "Where No Fan Has Gone Before".
Anyway, to each his own, but that is my take on the subject.
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Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
There is essentially one reason and one reason alone why the animated Star Trek (which isn't, in truth, a separate series but merely the a continuation of the original live action version) has been left out in studio policy. It has to do with the fact that Gene Roddenberry had a falling out with Dorothy Fontana (who did a huge amount of work on the animated episodes, writing and producing) during the early run of TNG, and declared it invalid to "get back" at her.
That of course is probably simplified a lot, and makes him sound very childish, but let's not forget that he had already done the same thing to Franz Joseph by deliberately writing the "Rules of Starship Design" to exclude his Star Fleet Technical Manual designs.
Anyway, Richard Arnold (Roddenberry's personal archivist/lapdog at the time) began replying to fan inquiries that the cartoon was non-canon, at some point Rick Berman and Mike Okuda (both very tied to Roddenberry) latched on to it as well, and the rest is history.
But it really isn't so clear-cut. Numerous episodes from later series (including TNG, DS9, VGR, and ENT) have made references to animated episodes, suggesting that they did in fact "happen." And given that, I think the whole "TAS is non-canon" spiel is really only played lip service to by the studio, in their public forums such as startrek.com. I'd wager it's safe to say that, behind the scenes, (especially with writers/producers Mike Sussman and Phyllis Strong working on ENT) the animated Star Trek is not being forgotten.
As to the quality of the show, it's about equal to the live action seasons of TOS, both at it's best and at it's worst. Yes, the animation is quite dated, but so what? The set and costume design on TOS is equally dated, and that doesn't stop one from enjoying those episodes, does it? The stories are, for the most part compelling, the characters are developed, and it has all the "feel" of TOS, just as a cartoon.
-MMoM
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Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Giant cloned Spocks is far lamer than someone stealing Spock's brain.
While both stories are shit, the live action shit beats the animated shit so TAS should (like TOS) be viewed as your own personal "canon" on a per-episode basis.
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Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
The "giant Spock" was pretty silly, but overall I don't think "The Infinite Vulcan" was a bad episode, per se. Cool Eugenics Wars references and those Phylosians (Trek's first [only?] use of a truly sentient plant species) were pretty cool IMHO.
Yes, there are better episodes, but there are also worse ones.
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Registered: Jun 2001
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Trek's first [only?] use of a truly sentient plant species
I seem to recall that ensign Vilix'pran had a tendency to bud, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's a plant, I suppose.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Giant cloned Spocks is far lamer than someone stealing Spock's brain.
I was thinking more along the lines of him as a remote control Spock, very similar to the later used remote control Keevan.
Also, in contrast to the giant cloned Spock...lets not forget the 6-inch runabout flying within the bowels of the Defiant, much less the crew romping around various "enlarged parts" all Honey, I Shrunk the Kids-style!?!?
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Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
I think producing large clones is more likely than removing and putting back someone's brain. Lots of animals have been cloned, and larger than normal size (admittedly not 10x larger) is a common problem. But giant inflatable Enterprises ( http://www.startrekanimated.com/tas_ep_joker.html ) and giant tribbles ( http://www.startrekanimated.com/tas_ep_tribbles.html ) are really pushing the silliness envelope.
BTW. I had never heard the word "jihad" until I watched TAS during its first run. Also I hadn't heard of genetically engineered creatures before watching "More Tribbles."
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Registered: Oct 1999
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