posted
First off, it wouldn't really be a prequel, would it?
Secondly, just basing a show on the USS Excelsior, Captain Hikaru Sulu commanding, leaves a lot of work to do. It's unlikely they'd adhere too much to the cast as established in ST:TUC - Rand too old, can't act; Valtane died of retconitis - they could maybe bring Tuvok into it (but how popular a character was he in Voyager?).
So, first you have to put together the cast, and there's all sorts of ways that could go wrong. Takei is old, his action days are behind him (that said, Patrick Stewart is only about 5 years younger, and the action scenes in Nemesis didn't trouble him at 60) so they'd probably have a younger hunkier (or sexier, needn't be male after all) first officer to provide sex appeal.
Then there's the plot. I still maintain that very little that's new was being done by Trek in its last few years, so. . .
posted
The idea itself is not inherently better. And the same people would have been in charge of it. So I don't see why it would have been any different.
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Does anyone think it's time for another Trek to take place in a space station? After all everyone says that Star Trek cliched, but I think its the premise that's cliched (ie ships zipping throught space). This time it could be a Federation constructed station like a starbase and maybe without an ubership attached to it.
Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
All due respect to Mr. Takei, but if "Flashback" is anything to go by I don't think he'd make a good lead.
But ultimately this all boils down to taste in set design, I bet. As Lee says, there's no show just waiting to leap out of Star Trek VI or "Flashback." It would have to be totally invented from the ground up, so all we've really got to make our decision is whether we would want X years of movie-era set design.
Also, I guess, if I were asked to choose an era, sight-unseen, I'd probably choose Enterprise (or even, as Sternbach talked about, some period even earlier). There isn't any particularly new ground for Sulu to cover. His show would have all the pitfalls of a prequel (can't introduce anything too novel without breaking continuity) with none of the benefits Enterprise had (the ability to go back and introduce core Trek concepts).
Now, having said all that, I like movie-era design just fine, and complaints about his ability to fill the lead role aside I'm sure I'd be willing to give Takei the benefit of the doubt for awhile. But anyway an Excelsior series never had much to recommend it, in my view.
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women: This time it could be a Federation constructed station like a starbase and maybe without an ubership attached to it.
Exactly what is that offering though? Part of the appeal of DS9 was the fact that Quark, Kira, Garak and Odo weren't Starfleet. They could do things that Starfleet officers could have. And for however much they were intergrated into the "gee wizz Starfleet" dudes as the show went on they still provided an alternative point of view when necessary, such as in "The Reckoning" and the like.
A show set on a Federation Starbase would, to me, involve Admiral McBeardy talking to Lieutenant Sensiblehair about which ships were due to arrive and whether they'd need any maintanence work.
(And to be fair to the Defiant, it wasn't really an uber-ship. Sure it had Kewl guns and a cloak, but that was about it. It was quite often outclassed by enemy forces. We're talking about a ship that could tear through half a dozen Jem Hadar fighters, not one that could take on the entire Romulan Empire.)
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I think what most people like about a "Sulu show" is that it would be set during the TOS-movie era. This is, arguably, the most popular time frame for trek.
We had most of the gee-wiz stuff of TNG, but with the classic look of TOS. But, I think that the reason it is thought of as looking the best is that 1) it had movie level budgets, 2) It was the only game in town as far as Star Trek goes.
Captain Saavik of the NCC-1701-B would likely be just as popular, with a third actress playing the part. Which would eliminate the age factor inherent with George. Again though the problem is the writing. Unless the studio was willing to employ actual sci-fi literate writers then we're probably better off watching "Lost".
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Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
When ST III was made, the idea was that Excelsior woudl take the place of Enterprise, but it was unpopular with fans, so we got the Enterprise-A instead. Gotta wonder how the follow-up movies and TNG would have been different if Kirk got Excelsior at the end of IV.
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Registered: Nov 2002
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posted
I may have been less opposed to an Excelsior series than I was to Enterprise. But I agree with Sol System that there would have been no way making this era into a series because there is hardly any new ground for stories, characters or just for set design.
-------------------- Bernd Schneider
Registered: Mar 1999
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WizArtist II
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posted
Well, why not a Next-Next Generation? We know the pitfalls of trying to avoid continuation problems with TOS & TNG, so let's move forward a century. How about intergalactic adventures. (We never really found out what happened to the Kelvins). Perhaps even a Trek based on some of the timeship tech. You get to goof around with history (without "discovering" Nazi planets or Gansta planets) and can have episodes set during ALL the previous series venues. (Think: "Trials & Tribble-ations")
I don't think Trek is dead. But I think its going through a Phoenix phase and needs to be reborn into a new format, not just a new setting for the same old Trek.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
So... Forrest Gump in space? The problem with a time-traveling Trek is that:
A) You can only have our heros drop into "classic" Trek moments so often before it gets really old and stretches credibility.
B) You can only have our heros be the ones who "really" made everything work out for the other era crew so many times before it gets really old and stretches credibility.
C) You can only have our heros have an adventure whilst simultaneously barely avoid damaging the timeline so many times before it gets really old and stretches credibility.
Now, wherever I said "so many times", insert the phrase "3 or 4 times" and we suddenly have a series comprised of 12 shows.
WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
posted
I didn't say it had to constantly interact with classic trek shows. I would not do more than 1 or 2 for each setting/series. My point is that it could be advanced tech with classic props that could tell stories that do not involve ANY of the previous series crews.
Kirk, Picard, & Sisko were not the ONLY people that "saved the Federation". There had to be other ships & crews that didn't just show up to blow up. I think these would make for good storylines. Say a new clue pops up about the loss of the U.S.S. Abaddon in the Lesbos sector 50 years ago. The TimeTrekkers could go investigate etc.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Bernd: I may have been less opposed to an Excelsior series than I was to Enterprise. But I agree with Sol System that there would have been no way making this era into a series because there is hardly any new ground for stories, characters or just for set design.
Oh, I disagree.
(Man, this feels like deja'vu) About 11 years ago (before the release of Generations and the premier of Voyager) I toyed around with a series concept dealing with a female captain of the newly christined Enterprise-B. I even came up with plot ideas for about 2 seasons worth of episodes.
Looking through the Chronology book helps set the tone for the times during Sulu's era as Excelsior captain.
Sulu took command in 2290. The first mission (cataloging planets and gasious anomalies... whoopee...) lasted 3 years, with ST:VI set in 2293.
We don't know how many missions Sulu commanded Excelsior. But let's focus on the time between 2290 and 2311. An Excelsior series could have easily been set anywhere within that time period.
2290 Kang, Kor and Koloth pursuid the criminal known as the Albino. What crimes did he commit? Did they involve any activities within the Federation? What about unexplored space near Klingon and Federation territories?
Curzon Dax was alive and well during this time. in 2289 he conducted talks with the Klingons. Did he handle any other negotiations or talks during this time? Jadzia and Dax weren't joined until 2367, leaving this time wide open for Curzon to be a recurring character with much development.
Klingon sleeper ship T'Ong was launched. At this time tensions were still high between the Klingons and the Federation. Was this the only sleeper ship launched?
2292 Klingons develop a ship that can fire while cloaked. Tensions are still high and could provide a host of stories with Klingons as bad guys.
2293 Events of ST:VI. Tuvok assigned to Excelsior.
Despite the Khitomer accords, there could be plenty of disgruntled Kliongs and Federation opposed to the treaty. Small border skirmishes could still occur. Additionally, humanitarian stories could be told dealing with the salvation of Qo'noS.
Spock becomes an ambassador. What treaties did he mediate?
The Romulans are still a villanous force at this time, despite their begnign actions during ST:VI
2309 Cardassians offer assistance to the people of Bajor. We do not know when first contact with the Cardassians occured. We do not know what kind of feelings existed between the Cardassians and Federation. We do know that at some point after the first contact the Federation and Cardassians engaged in a prolonged border war. How long? We don't know.
2311 Tomed incident. What was the Tomed incident? Was it a ship? Was it a colony? All we do know is the Romulans killed thousands of Federation citizens. Obviously tensions were high before this point. After Tomed, the Romulans had no contact with the Federation until 2364.
Figures of the time Most all of the TOS cast, including Saavik and Sarek Curzon Dax Guinan Tuvok Demora Sulu Mark Jameson (later Adm. Mark Jameson from TNG's "Too Short a Season)
Undeveloped/Underdeveloped Aliens (Presuming ENT never happened) Andorians Gorn Tholians Trill Society Tellarites Orions
Unanswered TOS questiones/Whatever happened to... The Melkots The Medusans The Doomsday Weapon The First Federation The Guardian of Forever The Whale Probe The Kelvans The Andromedan androids on Mudd's Planet The Talosians The Horta Eminiar and Vendikar Yonada (TOS: For the World is Hollow...) Where did the Preservers go and why did they do what they did? When was first contact with the Cardassians? With Bajor?
What, we can't have a series because there is no new ground for set design? That seems like a weak excuse. TNG and DS-9 didnt change their sets after being established, yet both series ran 7 years.
On the other hand, what about all these other alien cultures? Surely they have designs we haven't seen, such as the inside of a Gorn ship, a Tholian planet, etc...
No new ground for characters? Might as well stop making any Star Trek then. New characters can be created and developed all the time and established characters could have been fleshed out. What all do we really know about Sulu, Saavik, Sarek, Curzon Dax, Uhura, etc...
Say what you will about Sulu and the adventures of the Excelsior; there still is fertile ground for stories set between the TOS movie era and TNG season 1. It just takes imagination, quality writing, and a passion/care for what has already been established.
Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Fuck Sulu- they'd have been better off making Captain Harriman into a strong lead, then using several of the loose ends you brought up to establish a plot for the series.
...though no one knows anything more about the Preservers by TNG, and a lot of TOS issues are better off dead-The androids and anything "Mudd" related in particular. That Yonada thing too- skip it.
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