posted
Assuming that it does take a couple of days from the Typhoon sector to Earth, I can believe that the overall Borg incident lasted that long. I assume that after the Cube had broken through the first defense line of let's say 50 ships that could be gathered in time, Starfleet regrouped their forces around Sector 001, using around 100 ships. It is possible that about half of the involved ships was destroyed, and the latter battle lasted several hours, but not several days.
posted
Considering that site also says there's hundreds of ships in each class I'd take his information with a gain of salt.
------------------ Calvin: "I'm killing time while I wait for life to shower me with meaning and happiness" Hobbes: "I hope you're comfy." Federation Starship Datalink - Starship site of the new millennium.
posted
Better than a loss of salt, I suppose... j/k ;-)
Now, as for why the battle might have gotten worse near Earth... It's my opinion that the reason we saw so many of the same four classes of ships at the battle is that those four classes had been recalled to various shipyards to be upgraded (possibly to be given the new "environmentally friendly" warp engines). Now, if these ships were in the process of being refit (or even if they had already been refit, but hadn't had a shakedown), there could have been unforseen problems. Hence, the ships weren't working at 100% efficiency, so they were more apt to be destroyed. Of course, despite this, Starfleet couldn't very well tell them not to fight. They were probably the only ships around.
------------------ Col. Maybourne: "Teal'c... It's good to see you well." Teal'c: "In my culture, I would be well within my rights to dismember you." -Stargate SG-1: "Touchstone"
-Akira and Nebula are fast deep-space explorer ships, thus they got to the scene from faraway locations (Galaxies might have, too, but there are probably much fewer of those overall than there are Nebulas or Akiras). -Saber is a tiny ship, so perhaps it doesn't go far. Thus, there would be a swarm of such local-defence vessels near Earth to begin with. -Norway is a one-off ship never seen later. Perhaps something experimented on at the big research facilities of Utopia Planitia or Earth's yards? -Steamrunner seems old and ugly and not very fast if sleekness is a measure of speed (and it often seems to be!). These could be warships with no peacetime use, perhaps "floating docks" for planetary assaults (they do look like today's amphibious assault floating docks to me). Since ST:FC takes place in peacetime, the ships would be stocked in garrisons, possibly near Earth. Note that they fare extremely poorly in the battle, getting blown up in high numbers by single "belly shots". I can't see any of them taking a single hit and surviving, even though the other ship types do take hits without blowing up.
The odd thing about that battle was the absence of Excelsiors. Those are normally everywhere. Did they form some sort of an outer defence perimeter and were all destroyed there?
Saltah'na
Chinese Canadian, or 75% Commie Bastard.
Member # 33
posted
Marko's theory does explain one thing: how long it took for the Enterprise-E to get from the Romulan Neutral Zone to Earth. It CANNOT be in a span of several hours.
Perhaps the events that transpired in BoBW happened over a span of a week or something. Although the Borg Cube has some awesome capabilities, it- like all other starships- can only travel at a certain maximum speed. How long does it take for a Starship to travel between the outskirts of the Federation to Earth itself?
From what I read in the novelized version of ST-FC a fleet of ships engaged the Borg Cube in the Typhon sector. Rather than stay and fight the fleet, the Borg chose to break through the line as quickly as possible while inflicting as much damage within a short time frame. Not all ships in the Typhon fleet were destroyed, this including the Defiant, and Admiral Hayes' Flagship. I believe that Data mentioned that about 20 ships were in that Typhon sector fleet. This fleet followed the Borg cube to Earth where another fleet was waiting to fight the cube. No one knows how long this battle was, but it was long enough for the Ent-E to get to Earth to help finish the cube off.
------------------ I can resist anything....... Except Temptation
posted
Okay, here is a shot at what I think may have happened in First Contact:
Picard talked about an invasion. Bones would probably say: "Since when does 1 ship constitudes to an invision?"
Here is what I think what may have been the full conversation about the Borg invasion on the Enterprise:
Picard: "I just got a message from Admiral [whatever his name was]. The Borg are invading the Federation. We have put some 400 ships on it to intercept the [insert a number] Cubes. But the last thing I heard is that the Borg have broken through the lines."
=== Here begins the scene in First Contact:
Riker: "How many ships?"
Picard: "One, and it is... "
The rest you know.
------------------ "Reality is a condition that occurs because of a lack of alcohol." - Albert Einstein
(-=\V/=-)
[This message has been edited by Altair (edited January 26, 2000).]
posted
Remember there is a glut of evidence that the Romulans are one of the closest neighbours to Earth...
1. Romulan Wars in low warp vessels 2. Past Tense 1. Kira scans the area and there is no sign of Starfleet activity - the closest aliens are Romulans... they have colonies in the Rigel system - one of - remember the heaviest populated systems in the Federation... and close to Earth - at least I think its the Rigel system...
------------------ "...it might be easier to study ancient societies from distant orbit than it might be to sit next to the Guardian of Forever with a tricorder." - Baloo, January 2000
posted
Trek lore does indeed paint of a picture of the close proximity of the Romulan Neutral Zone. The original Earth/Romulan war was fought before the Romulans aquired warp drive against a fledgling interstellar United Earth. Based on the assumption that the Neutral Zone is somewhere within 20 light years of Earth (which would take a warp 2 capable ship 3 years to reach), it would have taken the Big E-E four days to travel that distance at warp 9.6, four days to get to Earth (even pushing the engines to its limits, 20 light years would take two days a warp 9.9, I don't know if Scotty could have kept her together at that speed for two straight days). [Rigel, BTW is 905 light years from Earth, and would technically take 181 days to reach at that speed, but we all know what kind of creative license the writers have taken regarding warp travel times. ]
That being said, I do have to agree with others on this list that the battle may have actually been a protracted series of meeting engagements, over a period of two to four days. A can see small task groups of 3 to 50 vessels, using every dirty trick in the book to disrupt the Borg Cube's warp fields, lay traps to force course corrections, harassing the Cube at every opportunity, inflicting as much damage as possible and then breaking off (perhaps hoping in vain to draw the Borg off of their intended target), all in a dedicated effort to allow other ships to reach the Sol System for the final stand, the very end of which we witness in those early scenes of ST:FC. I don't know if I can buy the loss of 400 ships, especially in light of the vast quantities of ships we see later being fielded in the Dominion War. Or maybe, this is in spite of it.
posted
I was going to mention the proximity of the Romulan thing too. Of course, the Neutral Zone extends for as long as the Empire and the Federation share a common border, so the Enterprise could have been at some distant point, but it also could have been relatively close to Earth.
------------------ "20th Century, go to sleep." -- R.E.M.
posted
Personally, I think they may have been at the nearest possible part of the NZ to Earth. Perhaps, even though the brass didn't want Picard in the battle, they figured they should keep him nearby, just in case (and a good thing they did, I suppose...). I don't think they took days to get from the NZ to the battle. I'm sure it was only a few hours. Of course, the way the movie was done, they made it look like about ten minutes, but I think we can ignore that... :-)
------------------ Col. Maybourne: "Teal'c... It's good to see you well." Teal'c: "In my culture, I would be well within my rights to dismember you." -Stargate SG-1: "Touchstone"
posted
But this is not the first time that the Enterprise has caught up with a Borg cube. Remember best of both worlds part 2 and the Enterprise D was able to catch up with it even though the Borg ship was faster and had a head start. Maybe the ships attacking it slowed the cube down.
------------------ "We set sail on this new sea because their is new knowledge to be gained and new rights to be won" John F Kennedy
posted
Do you mean in FC or TBoBW? In TBoBW, they were coming from the same place (Wolf359).
------------------ Col. Maybourne: "Teal'c... It's good to see you well." Teal'c: "In my culture, I would be well within my rights to dismember you." -Stargate SG-1: "Touchstone"
posted
In BoBW the Enterprise and the Borg Cube were travelling in the same direction but the Borg Cube travelled at warp 9.95 approx. It only slowed down at Worf 359 to destroy the federation fleet which did not take long since it destroyed the first 4 ships in less than 2-3 minutes. i assume the other ships would not last for more than 30 minutes. The Enterprise however was at the edge of the federation space with damage to her warp drive which took several hours to repair. Then it had a speed of about 9.2 but it eventually catched up with the cube. very unlikely i think.
------------------ "We set sail on this new sea because their is new knowledge to be gained and new rights to be won" John F Kennedy
posted
nx001a: I agree that the Enterprise hardly could reach the Sol system just a few minutes after the Borg. Where did you get the Warp 9.95 figure? I thought the Borg were a bit faster than the D's maximum emergency speed of Warp 9.8, but their speed not explicitly given.
]
Of course, the Neutral Zone extends for as long as the Empire and the Federation share a common border, so the Enterprise could have been at some distant point, but it also could have been relatively close to Earth.
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