posted
Playing Devil's Advocate here for the sake of Kris, but isn't it possible that they'd already fired their weapon and found that the Borg had already adapted to it due to Picard's knowledge? After all, the Battle at Wolf 359 occured some hours/days after Picard had been assimilated. He likely had reviewed the "Project: Wildfire" data, after all, so knew what to expect.
Of course, to do all this, you must dismiss what Mike Okuda said about those pods being sensor pods.
Just my thinking on the subject.
Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
I'm curious about something. Isn't anyone, not excluding Adm. Hanson, familiar with "Code zero, zero, zero... destruct... one." ??
I mean seriously, if you can set a ship's self-destruct to have a vaporization radius, instead of simply tearing itself to debris, why wouldn't they have tried this...? Eject and detonate the antimatter pods, or something...
quote: Ha! That's a good one! You should try to rearrange the LCARS framework a little bit (maybe stretch the whole canvas vertically) so you can fit that in...
As I said I've already tried and I don't want to screw up the size ratio by increasing the height.
Besides, it's a little too familiar for an official communication, especially if a copy is going to the Director of Starfleet Operations.
quote: My only remaining problem is that the Saratoga's outriggers were specifically stated by Okuda to be sensor booms. That, coupled with the fact that we didn't see them shooting those things at the Borg cube, leads me to believe they're not weapons.
Yeah but that's boring. Use your imagination boy!
Perhaps the program to get this weapon made that they didn't even have time to design a custom replication template, instead they were forced to jury rig a set of DSC-710 long range stellar observatory sensor booms that they had on hand. It wouldn't be pretty but the would have been good for a few shots at least which is all it would take before the Borg adapted.
So technically they were sensor booms and it's possible that the Saratoga got off a shot (off screen) before the Borg locked on with their tractor beam, then again perhaps the unit overloaded and never fired so much as a photon. (the particle, not a torpedo)
It doesn't really matter either way because we know that none of those ships (with the possible exception of the Endeavour) made it out of that system in one piece.
quote: After all, the Battle at Wolf 359 occurred some hours/days after Picard had been assimilated. He likely had reviewed the "Project: Wildfire" data, after all, so knew what to expect.
Not quite, this communiqu� took place after Picard's abduction (note Shelby's rank and position) and even if Wildfire was on the go before his abduction I doubt that Picard would have had time to read it. More likely he left it to Geordie & Co to handle the engineering problems (as we saw) while he concerned himself with the status of his ship and crew, maybe even going over the records of the J-25 encounter, talking to Guinan, liasing with Hanson about the status of the Armada, maybe even placing a call or two to Chancellor K'mpec.
quote: I mean seriously, if you can set a ship's self-destruct to have a vaporization radius, instead of simply tearing itself to debris, why wouldn't they have tried this...? Eject and detonate the antimatter pods, or something...
Raw energy had already proven to be of little use against the Borg. However Riker was about to attempt a high warp ramming manoeuvre which may or may not have worked. Something that I doubt any of the armada ships would attempt since at such close range they wouldn't have enough room to accelerate and besides at that point the cube was still 7.8 light years away from Sol, so it wasn't quite time for a kamikaze run yet.
posted
Anyone think that is what the Melbourne was doing in the Wolf 359 scene at the start of Emissary? It got pretty close before it was 'snatched' by the Borg tractor beam. Notice it was blue - was it blue in Q-Who? Maybe that shows that the Borg were already using assimilated Federation tech with their own?
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although its non-canon, most of fandom accepts Peter David's appellation 'Elizabeth Paula Shelby'.. its a plot point for her nickname in the NF novels.
Registered: Sep 2001
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quote: Anyone think that is what the Melbourne was doing in the Wolf 359 scene at the start of Emissary? It got pretty close before it was 'snatched' by the Borg tractor beam. Notice it was blue - was it blue in Q-Who? Maybe that shows that the Borg were already using assimilated Federation tech with their own?
I don't think so, she was too close for a warp speed ram.
quote: although its non-canon, most of fandom accepts Peter David's appellation 'Elizabeth Paula Shelby'.. its a plot point for her nickname in the NF novels.
I still wonder why the heck Starfleet never bothered developing Genesis as a last-resort defensive weapon... Of course, considering the reaction portrayed in TSFS and TVH, I guess it's understandable that the whole thing was buried and forgotten...
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Registered: Nov 2000
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quote:I still wonder why the heck Starfleet never bothered developing Genesis as a last-resort defensive weapon... Of course, considering the reaction portrayed in TSFS and TVH, I guess it's understandable that the whole thing was buried and forgotten...
My guess would be that the devise was banned by treaty. Then there's the small detail that it doesn't work properly and it's only real use is as a weapon of mass destruction, which is not what the Federation is all about...However, I'm sure there's a secret "Raiders of the Lost Ark" type warehouse and vault full of such dangerous devises, just in case. In fact a drew up a small list of potential doomsday devises before I settled on Genesis, I remember that one of them was an Omega bomb. My reasoning being that if they could destroy subspace around the cube that it would restrict them to sublight speeds, buying Earth and the Federation more time to come up with an effective defence. I decided however that this was a little TOO drastic since it would effectively cut off Sol and probably Alpha Centauri from the rest of the Galaxy, not to mention stranding all of those Starfleet and civilian ships in the blast radius.
quote:Originally posted by Reverend: In fact a drew up a small list of potential doomsday devises before I settled on Genesis, I remember that one of them was an Omega bomb. My reasoning being that if they could destroy subspace around the cube that it would restrict them to sublight speeds, buying Earth and the Federation more time to come up with an effective defence.
Yes, but
quote:Geordi Laforge said: ..."subspace Weapons were banned by the second Kihitomer Accords. They're unpredictable table:that's why they were banned."
Y'know, Starfleet still has the hulk of the planetkiller somewhere: you'd think they'd have reverse-engineered it after 100 plus years.
And (if starfleet really knows how), they could use some Romulan artifical singularity technology to make a nasty bomb.
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Registered: Aug 2002
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quote:Lt Cmdr Y.V. Ivannivoski? That's a unusual name
I didn't think it was any more unusualy than Admiral RA'Tash.
quote:Yes, but
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Geordi Laforge said: ..."subspace Weapons were banned by the second Kihitomer Accords. They're unpredictable table:that's why they were banned."
A treaty banning Omega would require that the Federation tell people about it, my impression was that the ban was secretly and unilaterally imposed by the Federation, in the words of a certain android "all other priorities rescinded". Regardless, it's a moot point, since as I stated the devise would probably cause as much trouble as it solved.
quote:Y'know, Starfleet still has the hulk of the planetkiller somewhere: you'd think they'd have reverse-engineered it after 100 plus years.
And (if starfleet really knows how), they could use some Romulan artifical singularity technology to make a nasty bomb.
I doubt that there was much left of the 'Planet Killer' after the battle. With it's power source knocked out, whatever forces that were holding the neutronium armor in shape would have probably failed, crushing the weapon with it's own mass. If so then it might eventually become a black dwarf and perhaps be consumed by the local star or large gas giant. So not much to study from a technological point of view.
As for the Romulan reactors, I doubt that their singularities are anywhere near as dense as the real thing, considering that we didn't see mini-black holes sprouting during the Battle of the Omarian Nebula or any of the later Dominion battles. Not to mention the battle with the Prometheus.
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