posted
OK this to begin with doesn't have any REAL spoilers but read any further posts at your own peril if you haven't seen The Matrix, The Animatrix or The Matrix: Reloaded.
I just have one little thing to wonder... some of the things in the matrix - symbolism - what are the black crows supposed to represent - I noticed them in the Matrix, Animatrix and Reloaded. Quite predominant. The Oracle even mentions them in the courtyard scene.
Another one from the courtyard scene - the newspaper being blown along - that is also in all three movies I think - or at least in the Animatrix and Reloaded (and maybe even twice in Reloaded).
Also the traffic lights - yes this is getting a bit David Lynch - but I noticed in the Animatrix story with the girl and the 'haunted house' (presence of a glitch/older program) that there was a lot with the empty streets and the traffic lights/pedestrian crossing lights.
Of course there is what was mentioned in the other thread - with the whole Red Pill and the Oracle with the lollies. Infact - what is it with her and food? Remember she kept Neo waiting because she was baking cookies. And what was that supposed to mean that he'd "feel alright after eating one of her cookies" in the first movie? She put Marijuana in them??
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Mabye they're Exiled programs or the remains thereof...a kind of machine afterlife.
I've been thinking about the confrontation with the Architect: The Architect rambles on about "she" this that that and Neo guesses "The Oracle". The Architect says "please" in a semi disgusted tone....mabye he was'nt refering to the Oracle as the program in question after all... mabye he meant Trinity. after all, everything Neo has done so far has been influenced by his love/attachment to Trinity. What if she's been manipulating him as part of the "big picture" and Neo's taking the left door avoided a chance for the humans to access the scourse and gain freedom as per the prophesy? Trinity would'nt even have to know she was part of the design, just lke Neo didint....and Neo only had his Matrix dreams while sleeping right next to her...
I know this sounds like a "magic bullet" theory but it sure would change he outlook of the next movie would'nt it.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
Hmm. That... would explain a lot. Quite a bit, really. Of course, it either assumes that the "Real World" is another simulation, or that Trinity is a human body being controlled by another computer program ala Agent Smith.
I've wondered about that: if the Architect wasn't referring to the Oracle, then who? Persephone (sp) is the only other "female" AI I can think of thus far.
-------------------- "This is why you people think I'm so unknowable. You don't listen!" - God, "God, the Devil and Bob"
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posted
The "architect" was scoffing at the grandiose name Neo was giving her, not her existence per se. And the birds were there because of John Woo.
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Didn't "The Matrix" establish that the original Architect, the one with divine powers like Neo, was the first to rebel and the one to teach the first batch of born-agains how to fight the machines? He seems pretty evil to me, not at all like Morpheus laid out in "The Matrix". Although Morphie's street cred took a bit of a dive in Act IV, no?
-------------------- "I'm nigh-invulnerable when I'm blasting!" Mel Gibson, X-Men
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quote:Originally posted by Sol System: And the birds were there because of John Woo.
Or was John Woo there because of the birds?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
Didn't "The Matrix" establish that the original Architect, the one with divine powers like Neo, was the first to rebel and the one to teach the first batch of born-agains how to fight the machines?
No. "There was a man born inside the Matrix..." Not the Architect. Presumably he was referring to what we now believe is the previous One.
-------------------- "This is why you people think I'm so unknowable. You don't listen!" - God, "God, the Devil and Bob"
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Reloaded is a metaphor for the cycles of existence as believed in Eastern religions like Hinduism and Buddhism. In these religions, life, death, and rebirth are seen as forming a repetitive, tedious chain that binds all life. Humans, animals, gods, demons, ghosts, they all die, and are reborn. There is nothing permenant about one's position in the order of things, except that one will always have a position, and that position will not last forever. The goal of one then should be to seek enlightment in order to break out of that cycle and escape to an existence beyond that of the flesh, even that of gods, ghosts, or demons.
So, Neo represents both the humanity's and the AI's choice in the future of their existence. There has been other 'The One' before, and they all chose to continue the cycle of dead and rebirth. The AIs and their captive humans, like gods and demons, has their existence dragged out for so long that they never really seem to die, but they are also 'stuck' being alive, for all the good and bad that does them. Zion, like an individual person, dies, but is always reborn again, only to experience essentially the same existence as before, its triumphs and defeats, only to die and be reborn again.
When Neo was given the chose of the two doors by the Architect, he was given an opportunity to break that cycle of death and rebirth for all sides. To have followed the Architect's direction would have meant another cycle of death and rebirth. To have chosen the other door means escape from that endless chain, into an existence unlike any before.
-------------------- "God's in his heaven. All's right with the world."
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quote:Originally posted by David Templar: [QB] Here's the way I see it...
. In these religions, life, death, and rebirth are seen as forming a repetitive, tedious chain that binds all life.
Like the Star Wars movies! ...and the A.I.'s are the only witnesses to it all.
That explains why agent Smith is so angry: he used to be C-3P0! ...and Neo's blank, vacant expresion in the Matrix is the ultimate evolution of Hayden Christensen's stilted acting! It's all so clear to me now....
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
OK my other metaphors I noticed - the wind blowing the newspaper, the focus on traffic/crossing lights -- what about them. They or each of them are in the Matrix, the Animatrix and Reloaded. And again - what is it with the Oracle and food? Again maybe it's the Matrix producers/directors trying to be David Lynch etc. "That's Damn fine cherry pie".
Also
About Hayden Christensen - if anyone complains about Keanu's acting abilities anymore - he's matured a lot - just see "The Gift". The crown has passed to Hayden Christensen. "It's all Obi-wan's fault!" Oh dear.
Also was it definately the "Architect" who was mentioned by Morpheus? I thought the first guy - had the abiltity to control anything he wanted in the matrix, and that he was human too.
quote:Morpheus also said the Architect had died and that The One would be his new incarnation. I probably shouldn't ask, nevermind.
So this was the previous 5th go around?
The videos behind Neo in the Architect's room - show all of the other times around Neo had been there? Or was it supposed to be different people each time? This leads me to think that they are all still in an even bigger program.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Possibly. However, I just assumed something simpler. From a computer point of view, it was probably trying to predict how Neo would react in an effort to gain the upper hand. Thus, the initial prediction to the "revelation" was rather difficult, each screen showed something different. But later, he goes on to say that denial is an extrememly predictable emotion...at the same time, pretty much all of the screens say "bullshit" For me, this just foreshadows the exchange at the end, when the Architect is totally unsurprised by Neo's new choice (v.s all the previous cycles)...he's forseen it, through mathemtaical prediction...and he's already arranged a contingency plan presumably.
quote: ...and the A.I.'s are the only witnesses to it all.
Interestingly, this seems to be true. The Nevogonim or whatever is aware of it and has confronted Neo's predecessors. Agent Smith also says that its all going as it has before.....but "not exactly". I guess only the humans are in the dark about all of this.
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posted
Also was it definately the "Architect" who was mentioned by Morpheus? I thought the first guy - had the abiltity to control anything he wanted in the matrix, and that he was human too.
I already answered that, I thought. Did I miss something?
-------------------- "This is why you people think I'm so unknowable. You don't listen!" - God, "God, the Devil and Bob"
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