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Author Topic: Domestic Surveillance
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

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So...what do ou all think of this latest revelation- hat tens of millions of phone records are now being kept by the NSA?
As one democrat asked "Are you saying that tens of millions of Americans are working for AlQueida?!?"

Meanwhile, the fucko most responsible for the NSA wiretappig and records-keeping programs is likely to become the cIA director.

Looks like more and more republicans are concerned over the degredation in privacy:
quote:
"I'm not sure why it would be necessary to keep and have that kind of information," said House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, who wanted more details.


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Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

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Jay the Obscure
Liker Of Jazz
Member # 19

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Perhaps that is part of the reason for this:

quote:
Bush job approval falls to 29 pct in new poll

Fri May 12, 2006 9:17am ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush's job approval rating has hit a new low, with 29 percent of the U.S. public saying he is doing an "excellent or pretty good job," down from 35 percent in April, according to a Harris Interactive poll in The Wall Street Journal Online.

The poll of 1,003 U.S. adults said 71 percent of Americans said Bush was doing an "only fair or poor job," up from 63 percent in April. It said the survey was conducted May 5-8 and had a 3 percent margin of error.



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Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war.
~ohn Adams

Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine.
~Brad DeLong

You're just babbling incoherently.
~C. Montgomery Burns

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TSN
I'm... from Earth.
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Just one more percentage point to beat Daddy.
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Jay the Obscure
Liker Of Jazz
Member # 19

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AMERICAblog links to a very interesting story from ABC.

quote:
Federal Source to ABC News: We Know Who You're Calling

May 15, 2006 10:33 AM

Brian Ross and Richard Esposito Report:

A senior federal law enforcement official tells ABC News the government is tracking the phone numbers we (Brian Ross and Richard Esposito) call in an effort to root out confidential sources.

"It's time for you to get some new cell phones, quick," the source told us in an in-person conversation.

ABC News does not know how the government determined who we are calling, or whether our phone records were provided to the government as part of the recently-disclosed NSA collection of domestic phone calls.

Other sources have told us that phone calls and contacts by reporters for ABC News, along with the New York Times and the Washington Post, are being examined as part of a widespread CIA leak investigation.

One former official was asked to sign a document stating he was not a confidential source for New York Times reporter James Risen.

Our reports on the CIA's secret prisons in Romania and Poland were known to have upset CIA officials. The CIA asked for an FBI investigation of leaks of classified information following those reports.

People questioned by the FBI about leaks of intelligence information say the CIA was also disturbed by ABC News reports that revealed the use of CIA predator missiles inside Pakistan.

Under Bush Administration guidelines, it is not considered illegal for the government to keep track of numbers dialed by phone customers.

The official who warned ABC News said there was no indication our phones were being tapped so the content of the conversation could be recorded.

A pattern of phone calls from a reporter, however, could provide valuable clues for leak investigators.



--------------------
Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war.
~ohn Adams

Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine.
~Brad DeLong

You're just babbling incoherently.
~C. Montgomery Burns

Registered: Mar 1999  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

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Sweet.
Just today I was listening to a NPR interview with a former NSA chief wherein he said that the notion of a "big brother" style government was not possible just now because there would need to me thousands of agents working with unlimited computer recources to monitor even a fraction of the population.

He did however point out that each time you go online, numerous private groups record your every move to build up customer demographics and the government (in their POV) should be entitled to the same access.

It was pointed out that with the phone records, internet records, financial tranaction records and the potential for cell phones to provide real-time GPS location, the U.S. government is already far more intrusive than the USSR was at it's worst.

Supoosedly though, it's all okay because there is no government group (that we know of) that coordinates all this information to make profiles on the citizenry.

The program also pointed out that most Americans are not trusting of the idea because the government was abused such power so often in the past (Nixon tracking Agnew's records, Bobby Kennedy tapping Martin Luther King's phone, the "red scare" of the 1950's etc.)

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

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Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

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Hiccup!

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256

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So, he pulled out the old "you have very little privacy anyway, so what does it matter if we read your mail, tap your phone, and track your online movements as well" stock defense. Imaginative.

"(...) the government (in their POV) should be entitled to the same access."

Because there is no and has never been a big brother.

Oh.

"...he said that the notion of a "big brother" style government was not possible just now because there would need to me thousands of agents working with unlimited computer recources to monitor even a fraction of the population."

And guess which organisation has both an employee count in the tens of thousands and the biggest cluster of supercomputers in the world?

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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343

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NSA's crypto division?

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"The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"

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Jay the Obscure
Liker Of Jazz
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quote:
Originally posted by Cartman:
And guess which organisation has both an employee count in the tens of thousands and the biggest cluster of supercomputers in the world?

I was going to say Wal-Mart.

Or the Post Office.

--------------------
Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war.
~ohn Adams

Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine.
~Brad DeLong

You're just babbling incoherently.
~C. Montgomery Burns

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Da_bang80
A few sectors short of an Empire
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I'm gunna go with IBM, I bet they've got a bunch of supercomputers.

Wal-Mart was gunna be my second guess [Smile]

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Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
The courage to change the things I cannot accept.
And the wisdom to hide the bodies of all the people I had to kill today because they pissed me off.

Remember when your parents told you it's dangerous to play in traffic?

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Sol System
two dollar pistol
Member # 30

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Wal-Mart's success is in large part attributable to its crazy advanced logistics.
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Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
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I thought it was low wages, cheap products from overseas and an unyielding music censorship policy.

Plus Voodoo, obviously.

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

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Jay the Obscure
Liker Of Jazz
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FEMA could learn something about logistics from Wal-Mart.

--------------------
Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war.
~ohn Adams

Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine.
~Brad DeLong

You're just babbling incoherently.
~C. Montgomery Burns

Registered: Mar 1999  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

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Naaa:
FEMA is a traditionally Santeria organization- bad to mix and match when The Spirits are involved.

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

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Jay the Obscure
Liker Of Jazz
Member # 19

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AMERICAblog links to this interesting story from Bloomberg.

quote:
Spy Agency Sought U.S. Call Records Before 9/11, Lawyers Say

June 30 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. National Security Agency asked AT&T Inc. to help it set up a domestic call monitoring site seven months before the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks, lawyers claimed June 23 in court papers filed in New York federal court.

The allegation is part of a court filing adding AT&T, the nation's largest telephone company, as a defendant in a breach of privacy case filed earlier this month on behalf of Verizon Communications Inc. and BellSouth Corp. customers. The suit alleges that the three carriers, the NSA and President George W. Bush violated the Telecommunications Act of 1934 and the U.S. Constitution, and seeks money damages.

"The Bush Administration asserted this became necessary after 9/11," plaintiff's lawyer Carl Mayer said in a telephone interview. "This undermines that assertion."

The lawsuit is related to an alleged NSA program to record and store data on calls placed by subscribers. More than 30 suits have been filed over claims that the carriers, the three biggest U.S. telephone companies, violated the privacy rights of their customers by cooperating with the NSA in an effort to track alleged terrorists.

"The U.S. Department of Justice has stated that AT&T may neither confirm nor deny AT&T's participation in the alleged NSA program because doing so would cause 'exceptionally grave harm to national security' and would violate both civil and criminal statutes," AT&T spokesman Dave Pacholczyk said in an e-mail.

U.S. Department of Justice spokesman Charles Miller and NSA spokesman Don Weber declined to comment.

One wonders why they needed to do this seven months before 9/11.

[ July 02, 2006, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: Jay the Obscure ]

--------------------
Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war.
~ohn Adams

Once again the Bush Administration is worse than I had imagined, even though I thought I had already taken account of the fact that the Bush administration is invariably worse than I can imagine.
~Brad DeLong

You're just babbling incoherently.
~C. Montgomery Burns

Registered: Mar 1999  |  IP: Logged
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