posted
If you thoroughly enjoy watching Voyager each week, then this isn't a question for you.
What went wrong with Voyager? it had such a promising beginning with Caretaker. now here's a new series that will really take the franchise into a new a wild direction. I mean come on, the Delta Quadrant, the Borg, this is going to be sweet.
But Voyager never seemed to really do what i thought it could do? why? personally i think its Janeway, I mean a female captain is a pretty nice idea, but damn it man, she has such an irritating voice. Couldn't they find anyone else?
------------------ "You put the geeks on the left and the stalkers on the right and you run for daylight up the middle" - William Shatner, discussing a Star Trek Convention on EW-
I would watch "DS9" and "VOY" regularly ... up until the episode when Seska turned traitor, I think was when I stopped watching VOYAGER. I guess when it came down to it, I only really had the time to watch one Star Trek show and I wanted to watch one with good stories, excellent characters, etc. etc.
I enjoyed VOY's pilot episode immensely. I remember such anticipation about the show -- the conflict between the Starfleet and Maquis crew members, but all that amounted to was Belanna throwing a dish at Chakotay.
IMHO, the writer's didn't script the show out. They should've laid down guidelines for what would've happened in each season ... ("Okay, season three, Torres finally calls the captain 'sir'").
It's also the little stuff. Honestly, I think they should have been "weathering" the sets every show, and every season. You know, paint some burn marks on the corridor bulkhead here, maybe leave a bridge panel with a smoking crater in it ... make it look like the dammed ship isn't going to a starbase every other week to get fixed back up again.
------------------ Star Trek Gamma Quadrant Average Rated 6.27 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux (with four eps posted) *** "Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!" -Omega 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001 **** "The candidate who slimed John McCain in the primaries and smeared Al Gore in the general election is now the president who pledges to elevate the nation's tone and bring civility to our discorse. Kind of like Michael Corleone brought peace to the mob by killing the heads of the other four families." --Paul Begala, Is Our Children Learning?
[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited February 25, 2001).]
------------------ Star Trek Gamma Quadrant Average Rated 6.27 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux (with four eps posted) *** "Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!" -Omega 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001 **** "The candidate who slimed John McCain in the primaries and smeared Al Gore in the general election is now the president who pledges to elevate the nation's tone and bring civility to our discorse. Kind of like Michael Corleone brought peace to the mob by killing the heads of the other four families." --Paul Begala, Is Our Children Learning?
Oh yeah, and the "AKIRA class with Quantumn toprzs and class XXXXXphaserz!" gang are upset about that aren't they? Besides, DS9 has had plenty of similar stuff, and a war to boot.
"Berman"
Ah. The guy who also created and ran DS9? The guy who was pretty much responsible for TNG after it's first two seasons?
"No continuity. Voyager disregards historical Trek events like the Eugenic Wars."
And? Jeez, be fair. You wanted the VOY writers to portray 90s Earth with the Eugenics war taking place? Brilliant. Confuse the hell out of the viewers who DON'T recall a 1967 Star Trek episode.
Besides, according to DS9, the Eugenics wars took place 200 years prior to the 24th century. You have to be consistent here.
The other arguements are fairer. Or I can't be arsed going through them all. You deceide.
------------------ "And Mojo was hurt and I would have kissed his little boo boo but then I realized he was a BAD monkey so I KICKED HIM IN HIS FACE!" -Bubbles
Ah. The guy who also created and ran DS9? The guy who was pretty much responsible for TNG after it's first two seasons?
Sorry, I meant Braga.
quote:"No continuity. Voyager disregards historical Trek events like the Eugenic Wars."
You wanted the VOY writers to portray 90s Earth with the Eugenics war taking place?Confuse the hell out of the viewers who DON'T recall a 1967 Star Trek episode.
Nevertheless, to ignore the war was the wrong way.
quote:Besides, according to DS9, the Eugenics wars took place 200 years prior to the 24th century.
I think there's a big difference between saying something wrong and showing something wrong.
The guy who co-wrote the fan favorite First Contact, along with a host of TNG's better episodes?
"I think there's a big difference between saying something wrong and showing something wrong."
Buh?
Personally, while I rather like Voyager and think it stands up under repeat viewing a lot better than I thought it would, if I were to suggest an overriding problem it would be their attempt to be all things to all people. Placing UPN on its back added new layers of complexity and red tape to wade through. Voyager could not be an enjoyable niche show, like DS9. It had to be appealing to a far larger audience, and they stumbled trying to figure out how to do that.
posted
I think what went wrong is that the feeling of being alone should have been more emphasised. I would personally have episodes mostly of Voyager at warp instead of spending entire episodes of Voyager chugging along at full impulse to at least show the crew trying to get home. I would not have involved the Borg as much but would have at least 4 episodes per season from season 3. I would also have recurring conflicts between Chakotay and Janeway trying to adjust to each other command style. I would have kept the Maquis raider but would have destoyed it by the end of season 2. I would have the Kazon feature every other episode with large groups in pursuit of Voyager with Voyager escaping just by the skin of her teeth. I would have left Kazon space 3/4 through season 2.
IP: Logged
posted
"I would have the Kazon feature every other episode with large groups in pursuit of Voyager with Voyager escaping just by the skin of her teeth."
Yes, that wouldn't have been predictable, would it?
As I recall, the kazon hit Voyager hard and long during the time they had. The humiliation of having their ship stolen will make some reviewers smile when Voyager get's back.
Besides, there's no hope for the Kazon, a testosterone-crazed race previously enslaved, now surviving as pirates, in stolen ships they can't manufacture themselves and will soon lose over bar-brawls with bigger fish. Bunch o' bums...
Fitz: Bad use of technobabble? It's always been bad, when the concepts are too vague to comprehend. Sometimes you can only make out "that thing is bad, this thing will make that thing go away if I stimulate it with THIS thing!" Data, Geordi and Wesley are the heavyweight champions on that one, I thought Torres made herself pretty clear in "Muse".
"Fixation on Seven and the Doc." Do you know how much it costs to make an episode? They spent all that cash on an entire episode ("Good Shephard") just to make up for that.
------------------ Here lies a toppled god, His turnip not a small one. We did but build his pedestal, A narrow and a tall one.
posted
I think, Voyager invents to often a technobabble-phrase to solve problems.
Yes, Braga. I'm sure he's the one who said in an interview that continuity sucks (ok, that weren't his exact words) and he pay no heed to other episodes.
posted
"I would not have involved the Borg as much but would have at least 4 episodes per season from season 3."
You wouldn't have involved the Borg as much? This is more than what Voyager's already done.
------------------ "This is such an amazingly minor complaint. Does anyone actually watch episodes anymore, or is it just a notebook + pause button exercise these days?" -Sol System on what constitutes modern day Star Trek watching, 02-22-01
"'I think there's a big difference between saying something wrong and showing something wrong.'
"Buh?"
I believe he means it's one thing for someone to say "200 years" when it should be something else. This can be considered a misstatement. It's quite another thing to have the crew actually go to the '90s and find no war. It's hard to call that anything other than discontinuity (unless you call it "blatant disregard for fans who actually pay attention to all the series as a whole, rather than forgetting each episode by the time the next one comes 'round").
------------------ "I am slightly disturbed that a news station in the US would use the phrase 'to the max'. What's next? CNN saying 'Totally righteous murders?' BBC News 'Dude, like people were wasted yesterday'. The Times reporting 'Iraq bombed! For Great Justice!'?" -Liam Kavanagh, 22.Feb.2001
posted
How about "attempt to save an SF franchise from being a complete and utter laughing stock?" You have an entire audience of people who have never even heard of the Eugenics War. You had a movie that developed out of it, but never even mentioned the event itself. And finally, you have people who can quite easily look out their windows and realize that, oddly enough, the world didn't collapse into a genetically fueled semi-apocalpyse in the early 90's.
Beyond which, why is this particular war so important? Why this one TOS reference and not others?
posted
Basically, we've got three references. One says late twentieth century, one says late 22nd century, and one, while an indirect reference, doesn't mention it in the late twentieth, as it would have had it existed then. I'd lean towards the mistake being the original ep.
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