posted
Hi gang, I was recently prompted to redesign one of my old ships after the lovely Reverend did his patch design. When I looked back at the old thing I saw nothing but flaws and decided it was worth redoing using my improved modelling skills, time having marched on somewhat since we originally made it.
As usual Reverend has been a source of design ideas and detailing suggestions, but as I'm a pretty hopeless Treknologist I decided I would throw it open to the floor and let anyone have a say. I'll post the occasional update pic should anyone prove interested, as I realise this forum is more heavily populated with talented 2D artists than 3D ones. Let me know what you think, what should and shouldn't be there and I'll try and make it happen. Thanks for any input...
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Uhh, one thing I cannot help blurting out is that this thing begins to look more and more like a Colonial Viper.
It's the leftmost pic, really. While there's no anhedral to the wings, their planform makes it look as if there was, from this angle. Combined with the nose deflector shape...
Mind you, it's not THAT bad if it looks like a Viper. But perhaps the warp engines inset into the wings could be made to protrude a bit, to remove the similarity? Not much, just the blue grilles bulging out a little. Or something like that. This baby looks almost *too* smooth now.
From the treknology point of view, though, the baby is perfect. Zero aft visibility, weird combination of aerodynamic surfaces and a wholly unstable and unaerodynamic basic shape, awkward access, weapon installations looking like afterthoughts... Everything is as it should!
I think that you have the front of a sleek, fast ship grafted to the ass of a low-budget boxy shuttle pod. I would make the rear end a bit less boxy or at least lower its height a bit. Do you intend for people to stand upright in the cabin?
Are those orange panels bussards or an intake of some sort. Whatever they are, I think they are slightly large for a ship of this size. However, if you are trying for an aggressive effect, sort of like having a massive grill and fenders on a gas-guzzling SUV, they fit.
Heed also the wise backhanded compliment of Timo!
Just my 2 cents.
Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
Thanks for the rapid input chaps, very good.
Colonial Viper, eh? I was expecting a barrage of Delta Flyer jibes but the Galactica reference is a new take on things. I suppose the rough layout is reminiscent of the Viper, but so are many things and you have to admit that Vipers were about the one good thing to come out of Battlestar Galactica. What you guys have to bare in mind here is that this is a very early work-in-progress, what I'm looking for from you guys is tips on what equipment it needs and where it should be placed on the ship to conform to accepted Starfleet norms. It might also help if you check out how the original looked when we finished it 18 months ago...
As you can see the newer version is a somewhat slippier design, despite the crappy aerofoils and boxy arse. What I was aiming for was a Trek equivelant of a ship I read about in 'The Mote in Gods Eye' by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle. It was a courier ship, a 'message sloop' it was called, a small and fast ship crewed by the toughtest men to get the message/parcel/VIP through.
As for my design, the ship is about 16 metres long right now, crewed by 2 and with seating and fold-down bunks in the rear so pilots can sleep in rotation. Entry will be via ramp from the rear, I don't like the old door on the original, and I think it's going to have extending langing legs of some sort (look good in animations). It's boxy at the rear because it needs to be, and the 'wings' serve no other purpose than to house equipment like the micro-torp launchers and the warp drive. In a time of field technologies and space travel I think it's moot to mention aerodynamic stability, this thing wont see much except hard vacuum for most of it's life. If I make it sleeker at the back it becomes too new, too reminiscent of the type 9 and we then have the problem of how to enter and exit it.
The intakes at the sides are just placeholders right now, Reverend has sketched up a design for the intakes that once again harks back to the defiant, with a heavy barred unit being installed with the bottom half as bussards and the top half as some indistinct grille. I'll build it and let you see what you think.
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Bloody laptop, I had a nice long response all typed out and it decides to press backup all by itself!
Ok, I think I started by mentioning that it's nice to have another 3D artist on the board since most of the old regulars seam to have migrated off somewhere.
I believe I then pointed out to Kenny that either my sketch or my explanation (or lack thereof) must have confused the poor man, for it was the top half that was supposed to be the ramscoop and the bottom structure was meant to be an impulse intake (or whatever those yellow-orangey things are meant to be). Next I think I provided some examples, hyare , hyare and hyare . Then I made some witty closing statement involving Albanian sheep herders, but I forget the punch line so I'll just quote ole Rodger (the bloke on the telly) and say; Bollocks!
posted
The only thing I would change is the top of the ship which might be more rounded. Maybe the two fins on the roof could be removed or moved closer together?
-------------------- Bernd Schneider
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I've updated the design a little with some suggestions from here and elsewhere, moving the impulse drives more outboard of the entrance ramp and instead of a wrap-around screen I've added a dark detail around the cockpit so it looks more unified. I can't do a decent wrap-around with such an angular design. it looks wrong and isn't really 'Trek' on a ship like this. That kind of screen is great on the little fat shuttles like the type 7, but not this angular design. As you can see I've also started placing panels and such as well.
Unfortunately it's a bit late now to make the upper part more rounded, and I plan to fill the upper trench with warp machinery and suchlike and it's going to look kinda lumpy there anyway. The upper bulges are going to be sculpted a bit more with parts being cut out here and there, and perhaps the ends scooped out somewhat to make them smoother at either end. I planned to have them as intakes or somesuch anyway, not merely as styling motifs or fins. I'm not sure about the placement of the impulse engines myself, but I got abuse for placing them too close to where the exit ramp will be. C&C welcomed...
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
I think I preferred the impulse engines the way they were to be honest and I wouldn't worry too much about them being to close to the door since several cannon shuttles have done just that (Type-6 & 8, ST:V shuttles and the Defiant's Shuttlecraft Chaffee). Apparently shuttle Impulse engines are able to cool themselves very quickly.
I must say that those dorsal radiator fins are a little distracting, wouldn't it be better if you closed that gap in the middle? Perhaps even sculpted them somewhat to give them a sort of concave effect.
In case you need some reference for the warp assembly, here are some pictures of the Aerowing's Dilithium swirl chamber. Aero core
Oh and that dark surround on the windows is a little too dark, try a lighter grey.
I planned to stick some device or other in the gap, not merely leave it exposed. I was planning on some nurnie or other to protrude out of the vent area and maybe have wiring or pipework reach out around the surround area. If I do cave in and just put fins in, I'll be sure to make them curve as you have drawn.
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Damn, I can't edit my post to add this so we get a twoofer...
Anyone want to have a bash at designing feet for this thing, I want to animate landing gear coming out? Nothing mega comlex please, but interesting and canon-ish if possible. i make make some sort of landing area for it, or enlarge my existing shuttlebay model so I can use this in a portfolio animation piece.
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Axeman 3D: Damn, I can't edit my post to add this so we get a twoofer...
Anyone want to have a bash at designing feet for this thing, I want to animate landing gear coming out? Nothing mega comlex please, but interesting and canon-ish if possible. i make make some sort of landing area for it, or enlarge my existing shuttlebay model so I can use this in a portfolio animation piece.
posted
This should be enough to get you started on the modelling, we can define and refine the details a little better as we go along.
This is only meant to represent the port or starboard landing strut as I'm not sure how to handle the forward one. Also it's shown here in it's totally straight and totally extended state for ease of reference, which would never happen in normal operations. As you can see it pivots in two places, a section of it telescopes and the toes all fold down when it's retracted.
posted
I think that'll end up making it look like the crab car from Futurama.
Perhaps a simple extendable skid or something like this would suit it better? (that one's a little rushed so it might not be quite so acurate, but you get the idea.)
posted
OK, check out the quick test animation located at http://www.axeman3d.com/posts/Comp1.avi and let me know if it's anything like you envisaged. I had to alter the toe design a bit, I have no idea how the mechanism would work for the ones you drew so I made nice simple ones. The animation shows the leg deploy and then retract, the deploy being quite mechanical and the retract being much smoother, as will the deploy be once I actually do it for real. Coded in DivX, but quite an old version so everyone doesn't need to go get version 5.05 of it. Aren't I thoughtful?
-------------------- www.kennyscrap.com - where I download crap I make.
Registered: Jun 2003
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![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Thanks for the rapid input chaps, very good.
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