quote:Originally posted by Harry: The rather 'Earthly' name of Aurora is due to the pilot being a space hippy.
I think Aurora or it's equivalent is present in the lexicons of every space-faring race. For the sake of Americans, who refuse to speak anything but English, even in the 23rd century, the alien "aurora" has kindly been translated.
quote:Originally posted by Harry: And space hippies are like, one step below evil alien nazis.
I think space pirates (as in that TNG episode) and space con-men are even worse!
I must admit, I've always hated FASA's Chandley.
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quote:Originally posted by Harry: And space hippies are like, one step below evil alien nazis.
I think space pirates (as in that TNG episode) and space con-men are even worse!
I must admit, I've always hated FASA's Chandley.
No....space hippies are DEFINITELY worse than space con-men or even the hackened "space pirates" but I'd be happy to never see an episode with any of them again: even in reruns!
...and the Chandley is a work of art: even if it's too wide to fit through Spacedock's doors.
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quote:Originally posted by Harry: The most ridiculous designs ever IMHO are the TNG Officer's Manual things created by FASA. Only God knows what the hell was going on there.
I totally agree about those baaad designs: by then, Paramount was not giving FASA anything to work with (thus the silly Starfleet/ Klingon hybrid ship) and Gene was not happy with how militaristiclly Starfleet was portrayed in the movies....the liscence was not going to be renewed and FASA knew it.....
A cluster fuck all around.
TNG did mange to establish a few FASA ships as canon via Conspiracy though, so it's not a total loss.
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Great job on the Starship Design Issue 16, the Potemkin movie era markings, and the Anton class. I have always liked the Aurora and found it to be a facinating design. I also am a big fan of FJ and his work, my favorite is the Federation class dreadnought. Keep up the great work and are you going to elaborate more on the Starship Design issue??
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quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: I totally agree about those baaad designs: by then, Paramount was not giving FASA anything to work with (thus the silly Starfleet/ Klingon hybrid ship) and Gene was not happy with how militaristiclly Starfleet was portrayed in the movies....the liscence was not going to be renewed and FASA knew it.....
You mean Gene was not happy with how realistically Starfleet was portrayed in the movies.
What surprised me with the TNG FASA stuff is why they never bothered to do the Ambassador concept, it did exist as a painting and also as a gold blob on the ready room wall even in the first season so everyone knew of it. The Klingon dreadnought with Excelsior nacelles - itself a bad kitbash of an existing FASA TMP ship which was not quite as ugly - was an absolute abomination.
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Gene was not happy that his "advanced humanity" of TOS had/was slipping into the bigoted crew of STVI.
The STII and VI resemble a Tom Clancy movie than Gene's TOS Trek. (oddly, STV has the closest emotional feel to TOS).
As to the Ambassador painting: who knows? FASA had very little contact or input from Paramount/Trek by that point: note the lack of Ferengi or other threat vehicles in the book as well. They got shut out.
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Unfortunately I must agree that STV was the closest film to TOS, since viewing some TOS eps again I realised just how dreadful most of it was, there's a couple of gems like the doomsday machine, balance of terror, that one with the Klingons on the Enterprise and that 'malevolent energy being of the week' that fed on their anger. There's more but I can't be arsed to remember them. The rest just haven't stood the test of time.
STVI may have portrayed humans as bigoted - which we are, and always will be - but what I thought more important was that it showed them overcoming their prejudice (or at least Kirk overcame his 'you've restored my son's faith' or whatever the line was).
P.S. speaking of FASA's ineptitude - Romulans with photon torpedoes and totally gimpified ships; what were they playing at? Oh and the Klingon 'Dangerous Fat Man' battleship.
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Kirk and crew were not bigoted just one movie prior so why the collosal chip on their shoulders in STVI? The whole prenise of Trek is that humans have already overcome our (current) petty natures and strive for something better and unselfish. Which the movies competely overlook.
Romulans do indeed use torpedos (at least by TNG anyway) so who's to say when they started using them instead of the Plasma Weapon? FASA even went so far as to explain why they switched and the resistance they had to using "alien" weaponry instead of the Plasma Weapon (with it's very limited range).
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I don't recall any specific mention of photons being used by the Romulans in TNG, we just assume those little balls they fire are torps, they may be an advanced form of the plasma torpedo without the range limitation - technology advances in Trek, photons have developed a lot since Kirk's time so why not the plasma torp?
Edit: I prefer humans be portrayed in a realistic light - we may eventually abandon civil war, flawed economics, even money, and all the other evil-bad-nasty-stuff that those damn commies who go to university tell us are bad. But we'll always posses our deep rooted base drives, i.e. to kill, to procreate and to accumulate worthless stuff. Greed will follow us to the stars wether we want it to or not. GR had some very unrealistic expectations of humanity, about the only thing I'll admit he got right was that we'll one day abandon God. Ironically the thing everyone else thinks is his major failing.
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I'm not sure I agree that ST 6 showed the crew as super-bigoted. They had a predjudice agianst the Klingons, sure. But remember, there had been decades of unremitting hostility. Why wouldn't they be a little edgy around them? I agree it doesn't quite fit with inviting the crew of a bird of prey over for drink from the last movie, but they were only dealing with one ship, not the prospect and tensions of forming an alliance between governments.
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It's just that they (morally) slipped a LOT from the TOS characters to their movie-era versions.
Mabye they just got old and republican.... Comes with their Starfleet AARP cards.
Besides, it's not just the TOS cast depicted as prejeduced: it's ALL of starfleet: the whole "only the top of the line models can even talk" line is cringeworthy: right out of a KKK rally!
I dont think it's just the Klingons they'd have had issue with: the same would have happened with Gorn or any non-human looking species becoming allies. Trek went from being better than us to far far worse....in ONE movie!
I dont see that as "realistic", just pathetic.
Only Spock remained true to character. Go Spock-O!
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Well, erm, I wouldn't say they became worse than us - certainly your KKK mention is an exageration. Besides which they are friends with the Gorn, further there're many races within the Federation that are even more outlandish than the 'foreheads' as the Cardassians call them. What about the Andorians? The Tellarites? Hell, what about those ones that can't breathe in M-class atmospheres - the other-other blue guys. Also it's well known that Klingons aren't the brightest matches in the box - that's probably where the line came from.
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When did they become paals with the Gorn? I dont think te Gorn were ever mentioned again (aside from Sisko's reference in Tirals nad Tribulations).
As to the other races: where are they in the movies? The Federation President is about as "non human" as shown and that a slim distinction at best. Anyone watching the movies and unfamillair with Trek would think Starfleet was a humans-only organization (with the occasional token web-footed alien thrown in to make Chekov seem even more dumb than usual). that might have served the obvious cold-war theme of STVI, but it's certainly not what Gene intended for Trek to be (thus his annoyance at the militaristic aspects nad parralells to modern US military structure instead of exploration).
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"When did they become paals with the Gorn? "I dont think te Gorn were ever mentioned again (aside from Sisko's reference in Tirals nad Tribulations)."
The Gorn weren't, but Cestus III was. The fact that it had human inhabitants in the 24th century has led people to believe that the Federation must have made up with the Gorn.
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