posted
I'm guessing that the hover craft were actually built in the early twenty first century and have survived all this time. After the various destructions of Zion, the new populous finds the wrecks of their predecessor's hovercraft and assume that they are wrecks from when the machines took over. They then rebuild them and reuse them.
However, it still leaves the question as to what the new Zionese know or think they know when they find Zion and how much of Zion is intact.
quote:Originally posted by Nim: Of course, since neither the Oracle nor Morpheus can be trusted to be accurate, everything's out the window, fucked up, fucked down, fucked sideways.
I WANT TO SEE "REVOLUTIONS"!!!
Amen man. The trailer for Revolutions looks better than that of Reloaded. However, it has ALOT to live up to so I'm going to try and not raise my hopes. And thanks everyone for your help with the ship names.
How about this: When the Mechines attack and go for the kill, they try to keep as many mechines alive for the next bunch of humans to take over.
or if it is just a Matrix in a Matrix (which I dont like, or believe) they could just bring up the code to put more ships there.
For the next bunch of humans I would say that the One tells them were to go. (and other things, like search out for the Oracle, or There will be another one)
-------------------- "That's the problem with nature. Something is always stinging you or oozing mucous on you. lets go watch tv." - Calvin & Hobbes
Registered: Nov 2001
| IP: Logged
posted
First off, obviously the machines wouldn't spare 23 Zionians to be brainwashed into becoming the new "founders" of Zion. If Neo would've cooperated with the Architect then 23 fresh pod-people would've been "liberated", after Neo had checked them out inside the matrix and assured himself that they'd be made of the right stuff and up to the challenge of creating Zion and liberating more people.
Secondly, the machines could have whole stockades and reserves of human transports and vehichles in mothballs from the original war, ready to be "planted" and rediscovered by the new batch of humans.
Though I doubt most machines are aware of the "great illusion", to make it seem realistic. The agents were certainly held out of the loop, kept on a strict "need to know"-basis...
-------------------- "I'm nigh-invulnerable when I'm blasting!" Mel Gibson, X-Men
Registered: Aug 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
Just getting back to the confusion on the spelling of one of the ships, I was playing Enter The Matrix on GameCube with the subtitles on and in one of the filmed cut scenes there is a reference to "Jacob from the Gnosis". Now the script for the game was written by the Wachowski's so its safe to say its the actual "Matrix canon" spelling.
Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
posted
Interestingly enough I just saw "Reloaded" again and the reference to the Gnosis does also reference that same "Jacob" as the game.
With the multiple theories about the multiple Matrix's I thought this point which might add scope to the time span of each of the multiple Matricies...
Councillor Hamann says he spent the first 11 years of his life asleep. We can assume he means he was freed from the matrix at the age of 11. Anthony Zerbe (the actor who plays him and interestingly enough, Admiral Matthew Dougherty in Insurrection) is 67 years old according to the IMDB. If we assume Councillor Hamann is the same age, then that means that the current matrix has run for at LEAST 66 years. just a thought.
Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by aneurysm: Interestingly enough I just saw "Reloaded" again and the reference to the Gnosis does also reference that same "Jacob" as the game.
With the multiple theories about the multiple Matrix's I thought this point which might add scope to the time span of each of the multiple Matricies...
Councillor Hamann says he spent the first 11 years of his life asleep. We can assume he means he was freed from the matrix at the age of 11. Anthony Zerbe (the actor who plays him and interestingly enough, Admiral Matthew Dougherty in Insurrection) is 67 years old according to the IMDB. If we assume Councillor Hamann is the same age, then that means that the current matrix has run for at LEAST 66 years. just a thought.
56 years, surely?
Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
posted
Just curious, did anyone do a quick head count during the scene with the council meeting to see how many captains there were? They were after all, convinently color-coded ala ST. It would give us a rough idea as to how big the human fleet was, at minimum, and how many people they had running around in the matrix (assuming a minimum of 3 per ship, and most ships being out and about at any given time).
-------------------- "God's in his heaven. All's right with the world."
Registered: Apr 2001
| IP: Logged
posted
That actually brings up another question (for me anyway): Why do the rebels hack into the Matrix? Is it for the sole purpose of freeing minds? Or are they doing something else?
In the first one, we were sort of left with the impression that all the Zionese believed in The One, but we only had Morpheus' point of view and that of his crew who obviously believed in him. So the impression was there that *all* the crews were looking for the One. But it turns out that very few people believe as Morpheus does. So is the mission of these ships solely to free minds from the Matrix?
posted
I'm not so sure. Although I think that is a major reason why they hack in, there must be some other reason IMO. Maybe they can somehow use it to fight against the machines?
Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
Seriously though I think it must be something to do with the fight against the machines, possibly allowing them to share information without having to head back to Zion or using traceable radio waves (We saw the blind dump thing in Final Flight...).
-------------------- "I am an almost extinct breed, an old-fashioned gentleman, which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-bitch when it suits me." --Jubal Harshaw
Registered: Feb 2002
| IP: Logged
posted
Well it seems to be a very systematic practise, and all significant crewmembers of all those ships met inside the matrix, in the beginning of "Reloaded". Just being in the matrix is potentially lethal for a rebel, I do not think anyone spends more time there than they absolutely have to. Everyone liberated knows how dangerous the agents can be.
Another theory, one that worries me. Agent Smith obviously tried to "assimilate" Neo before the 'Burly Brawl' started, and he made it clear he was after something Neo possessed. Thus, any information Bane carried was absorbed by Smith, and so he had very good information about the ship his host was serving on, probably even the EMP.
If this is true, Smith would be a golden goose to the machine hegemony, lets hope he carries enough scorn for his former masters to carry on his maverick routine out of spite.
-------------------- "I'm nigh-invulnerable when I'm blasting!" Mel Gibson, X-Men
Registered: Aug 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
Hmmm... the point about the meeting in the Matrix is a good one. Ships scattered all over the planet could communicate with one another by meeting inside the matrix. They could also leave information there to be found by other rebels. I haven't seen Osiris yet, but I'm guessing something like that happened.
quote:Originally posted by aneurysm: With the multiple theories about the multiple Matrix's I thought this point which might add scope to the time span of each of the multiple Matricies...
Councillor Hamann says he spent the first 11 years of his life asleep. We can assume he means he was freed from the matrix at the age of 11. Anthony Zerbe (the actor who plays him and interestingly enough, Admiral Matthew Dougherty in Insurrection) is 67 years old according to the IMDB. If we assume Councillor Hamann is the same age, then that means that the current matrix has run for at LEAST 66 years. just a thought.
Poor math aside, Morpheus actually stated in his address to Zion that they had been fighting the Machines for 100 years.
Which would mean that it has been approximately 500 years since the Second Renaissance, which would put the actual year of the movies somewhere around the 2600's!
I don't buy the "Matrix within a Matrix" theory for two reasons.
1. It's a cheep trick and is far too predictable.
2. Know one in Zion remembers what happened the last time around because know one ever survives except "The One" (which puts a slightly more ominous twist on his title).
If you remember, the Architect told Neo that if he chose to go to the source that he would have to choose X amount of people from the Matrix to free and start Zion all over again. Zion need not be in the same place every time, there could be four other Zions out there, buried under a mountain of rubble. Also remember what Morpheus said in the first move, that The One who came before freed "The first of us" meaning that each successive Zion is descended from Matrix escapes, not survivors of the war with the machines. (Which would also explain why they don't know the year, coz they don't know how long the Matrix has been online). Presumably the naturally born humans that we saw (Tank, Dozer, Link) are descendants from a previous generation of liberated minds.
posted
Basically Aban, the crew of the Osiris discovers the machines digging in to Zion and as a rsult get attacked by sentinels. During the ensuing chase through the sewers Jue, the first mate of the Osiris hacks into the matrix and posts(!) a disc with the info on and sends a message to Zion telling someone to retrieve the disc. Why they didnt just transmit the info to Zion rather than the dump is beyond me.
On another note we also find out that Zion is 4 kilometres underground. that seems pretty close to the surface in my opinion. Surely it wouldn't take the machines long to dig to that depth?
Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic
