Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
"And the same people that cheer over this would scream if someone even proposed a bill with biblical backing...."
Well, you see, while we don't know for certain WHAT is causing the Earth to warm up, most of us DO understand that it is in our best interest to counteract the process (what with these things called cities being located in those other things called coastal regions, for one) by at least reducing our contribution TO it. There is, you know, something at stake here. Thus the knee-jerking.
"The planet survived thousands of other problems. Asteroids, Comets, Volcanos. I'm sure it can survive us."
Our main concern right now is surviving IT, which would be easier if we didn't have to contend with massive floods and, oh, toxic air.
-------------------- ".mirrorS arE morE fuN thaN televisioN" - TEH PNIK FLAMIGNO
Registered: Nov 1999
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
Also, Dabang, read a geology book sometime. You might actually learn something.
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
Cartman, I agree with cleaning up the world, and I know about the dirt and grim in some of the coastal cities a flood would clean up nicely, but using half assed methods for such important, to humans anyway, scientific work, is no better than what I stated.
The means being justified by the ends is not always the case....
Hey, I also know of another case people are upset about, you see, this one country was invaded by another country, and the leaders of the invading country may have twisted some of the information to make it sound like a good idea. Well, the country they invaded was run by a crazy guy that killed his own people... So the ends justified the means....
-------------------- "You are a terrible human, Ritten." Magnus "Urgh, you are a sick sick person..." Austin Powers A leek too, pretty much a negi.....
Registered: Sep 2000
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Cartman
just made by the Presbyterian Church
Member # 256
posted
The jury's still on out that, and probably will be for the rest of the decade.
In my book, using "half-assed" (even though half the scientific community thinks they aren't, and a neo-conservative source such as the Calgary Herald does little to make me migrate to the other camp) methods in an effort to keep this planet habitable is just as excusable as pre-emptively invading another country is in yours.
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
Ritten: "I know about the dirt and grim in some of the coastal cities a flood would clean up nicely"
You know, in the Donald Duck-world you describe, that might hold true.
In reality though, besides making a lot of people very homeless and the less agile people very dead, a flood would transport things like sewer water, public toilet content, industrial waste and general diseases to your bedroom.
If you ever have the honor of experiencing that phenomenon, cherish it, it will strengthen your character. Everything else goes.
Registered: Aug 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Da_bang80: I think that this world could stand to be a few degrees warmer...
How do the scientists know that the recent trend is human caused. They use tree rings and other crap to determine what the temperature used to be like.
But how do they know what the Earth's temperature was 80 million years ago? They can't, cuz they weren't there. So they have no basis on which to make thier claims.
The planet survived thousands of other problems. Asteroids, Comets, Volcanos. I'm sure it can survive us.
Actually that is exactly the point - the planet and many of the other species on the planet are going to do just fine. What we really should be concerned about is ourselves. Bottom line - our population keeps going up as we use up resources in our environment. We will reach a point where our population crashes, not extinction neccesarily, but crashes. This would not be a pleasant thing to be around.
We have an alternative - we can take measures to control our population and to manage our use of resources. It comes down to if we want to take a long view or just live in the moment as a species.
-------------------- Twee bieren tevreden, zullen mijn vriend betalen.
Registered: Oct 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Ritten: Hey, I also know of another case people are upset about, you see, this one country was invaded by another country, and the leaders of the invading country may have twisted some of the information to make it sound like a good idea....
And it's even more of a parallel since the US stands bullheaded against the rest of the UN!
-------------------- "Nah. The 9th chevron is for changing the ringtone from "grindy-grindy chonk-chonk" to the theme tune to dallas." -Reverend42
Registered: Sep 2000
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-------------------- "You are a terrible human, Ritten." Magnus "Urgh, you are a sick sick person..." Austin Powers A leek too, pretty much a negi.....
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted
Unfortunately, you are wrong. I just saw Jimmy Carter say so in an interview last night: carter pointed out that voters rally behind a Commander In Chief during wartime and dont really want an unknown quantity during such an uncertain time.
Sucks, but we're gonna get stuck with this fucker for another four years (barring serious impeachment-level scandal).
As to the Environment: It's common sense that we shouldnt be using up all our rescources and expanding our populations at the same time but anyone trying to enforce those policies would be laughed out of office.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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"...voters rally behind a Commander In Chief during wartime and dont really want an unknown quantity during such an uncertain time."
But the question is, do more people feel that way, or do more people feel the war is Bush's fault in the first place, and we need to replace him to fix it?
Registered: Mar 1999
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Da_bang80
A few sectors short of an Empire
Member # 528
posted
I'm well aware of the general temperature of the Earth during the age of the dinosaurs. I was thinking along the lines of specific warming and cooling trends over the millennia.
A rock or layer of the Earth's crust can't tell you the exact temperature over the span of a decade or so, as rocks and the Earths crust take much longer than that to form a layer. Except maybe rocks formed by volcanic material.
They didn't have accurate measurments of temperature back then, unlike today. The only know that the Earths temperature shifted by several degrees in a pattern, very slowly.
Pollution may be speeding the process, but I don't think it's the cause.
-------------------- Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change. The courage to change the things I cannot accept. And the wisdom to hide the bodies of all the people I had to kill today because they pissed me off.
quote:Originally posted by Da_bang80: I'm well aware of the general temperature of the Earth during the age of the dinosaurs.
What evidence are you using?
quote: A rock or layer of the Earth's crust can't tell you the exact temperature over the span of a decade or so,
But you can get information from geological and polar/icecap data that can be applied to today.
quote: They didn't have accurate measurments of temperature back then, unlike today. The only know that the Earths temperature shifted by several degrees in a pattern, very slowly.
Who the dinosaurs?
quote: Pollution may be speeding the process, but I don't think it's the cause.
Based on your independent research? Or what? Rectal extractions?
-------------------- Twee bieren tevreden, zullen mijn vriend betalen.
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
Nim: I haven't, and my smart ass remark, I guess, is more ass, reading it again later.
I am still of the mind to agree with the other camp, that this is a cyclic thing, like the poles, that changes over time, and this Canadian paper isn't the first time I've heard about it. PBS or Discovery channel have had the scientists on with the opposing point of view.
It is like all these new ailments that are cropping up, I never had a clue that people suffered from so many different problems that needed special attention. Or are they renaming extreme condidtions for typical things? I don't know, the the desease names seem to indicate it.
-------------------- "You are a terrible human, Ritten." Magnus "Urgh, you are a sick sick person..." Austin Powers A leek too, pretty much a negi.....
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted
Once again -regarding climate change - even if it is natural we may still need to take action to protect all those cities on the shore mentioned earlier...
Alot of the "new" diseases/conditions aren't new, but some are. New diseases (like SARS) do pop up from time to time. We're much better at ID'ing them these days but bacteria and viruses are continually evolving - sometimes they evolve in a way that isn't good for us.
-------------------- Twee bieren tevreden, zullen mijn vriend betalen.
Registered: Oct 2000
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