posted
One would think that "generation" would be most likely to stand for "generation." (Of course, since the most likely explanation would then mean that the Bible was wrong, it must be overlooked in favor of semantic legerdemain, right?)
Oh, and wouldn't you actually need to learn Aramaic first?
------------------ "We shall not yield to you, nor to any man." -- Freak, The Mighty.
posted
Well, if you won't accept that answer let me give you two more possible ones.
1. The def. for generations is a human one. Jesus may have had a different def. After all, He spoke in parables and somethings He only told His disciples.
2. One possible, little known view is that we live in the "almost and inbetween". That is, we are very close to Heaven on Earth. That could explain the statement. I have not studied this myself yet, but I believe it is possible.
I don't have NT until next semester... speaking of reading, I need to get off this board.
------------------ It's all about the Pentiums, Baby! "I'm down with Bill Gates, I call him Money for short I phone him up at home and I make him do my tech support"
Some parts refer to Armageddon, some refer to the fall of Jerusalem, some to both.
The Bible was originally written in Hebrew (OT) and Greek (NT), with a little Aramaic in the OT, so why would we need to learn Aramaic before we learn Greek? Or is this just a Monty Python joke? The Greek word that was translated as "generation" can also be translated as "race". At the risk of sounding like a Mormon, it's a mistranslation.
The difference between helping someone and stopping someone from doing something is that you can refuse the help.
------------------ "Don't you try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal." - Zaphod Beeblebrox, `The Restaurant at the End of the Universe'
posted
Unfortunately, mistranslation *can* account for a lot of misconceptions about the Bible and what was actually meant.
I just finished spending an hour reading through all these postings. Fascinating discussion for a student of the Bible to read. But, I'll have to give it some more thought before a more in-depth reply. (One thing I don't like to do is step into something unprepared...James 1:19)
posted
Ok I'm not really God. Who needs that responsibilty huh? I'm really the devil. No, not Satan, that is merely a title. I'm not a true advisary. This whole thread is about evil and why a benevolent creature like God would allow it. Hey, just because you are at the top of the food chain doesn't mean you are special. It just means you kill better than any species alive. It doesn't have anything to do with brains, but is more to do with not having claws and sharp teeth and not being able to run fast, and you created subtituitions for those genetic weaknesses. That you do a good job with--untapping the energy of the atom for destructive purposes was far beyond our expectations of you. Accolades to the human beast. We are actually very bemused by your attraction to figuring out this whole good-evil thing we got going on. We are more amused that you seek to find some sort of explaination for one or the other. Honestly, the other animals don't really care about the concept. It is rather simple. I got to live, something has to die. That is the cycle. That is reality. You humans confuse the issue by superimpossing morality over it. You invented morality, not us. The sematics of good and evil don't even come close to concerning us because we are so above that concept. We are gods afterall. In our eyes, there is no concept of good and evil. It is what needs to be done to achieve the outcome we are looking for. And there is no master plan. We are just fucking off. It's like a road trip. Spontaneous, unknown, and just for fun. So why are you people so damned concerned with it. Just fucking live. Be a participant instead of an obswerver and go with the flow.
And hey, I'm not out to offend anyone. If you are offended it is because you have your head so far up your ass, you can't see anything but shit.
posted
I went to a fellowship today composed of only females in my youth congregation. The pastor's wife, who's currently earning her Ph.D. in a seminary, shared the story of how she met her husband. It goes like this: She was an international student in L.A. and went up to northern CA during a ten-day mission trip. There she was offered a job at a church and "miraculously" received funding from another church to cover her tuition and housing if she were to move the San Francisco. She went back down to L.A. to pack up things and say goodbye, but had to return to SF six days earlier because of a friend. When she returned, she spent the spare weekend (when she would otherwise still be in L.A.) at a 3-day retreat. And there, she heard the complaint of an elderly woman about her son who's suddenly going into ministry and was compelled "by the Holy Spirit" to share her own testimony. Afterwards the old woman introduced her son to her, who would become her husband two years later.
There is a point in mentioning all this. Throughout the entire time she was telling the story, she credited her getting the money, forced to return to San Francisco too soon, going to the retreat, and the old woman's sharing her testimony to "God's will" and "God's plan". She said that our plans don't matter because God has a plan of his own, one that will happen no matter what we do. Then she went on and told us that we don't really need to go out and look for a potential husband because God will give him to us, which is why we shouldn't date unless we intend to marry the guy.
What is wrong wit this picture?
What I realized by now is that a truly devout Christian will pray and do whatever God "tells" him or her to do. It's forever "God's will" and "God's plan" and never yours. What free will is there? Perhaps some prayers get answered and some miracles happen because those people gave up their free will already.
------------------ "I told you. You're dead. This is the afterlife. And I'm God." --Q to Picard, "Tapestry".
I've actually spent some time reading back on the posts.
I believe in a different God that you people do. One that is more tangible and controlable. In my view the soul is to God/Goddess what the neuron is to the brain. Does that make any sense to you? We are a part of a larger whole. As a part we have responsibilities to that whole. They may be personal resposibilties or public. It depends on your outlook. In short, we are the Godness. We are part of the consciencenous of God. To envision the Mind of God means to look at your own life and the way you percieve things and to look at the society you live and consider the socities that you don't live in and join them together. I think that people have turned away from being responcible and lay it upon the concept of God.
"God will destroy us all!" is the End Times thought. To be more realistic, "We will destroy ourselves." If we are stupid enought to allow it. I think there are some members of the human race pulling more of their share of the weight of such prophesy to make it not come true. Why? Because they realise their realitionship with God is Equality Between God and the Soul of Humans.
"God said kill this group and burn this city because I don't like them?" Let us take a look back on the time of mankind when society was young and cilization wasn't so civil and the unifiying force between two individuals was what they believed spiritually, and what they believed to be true from those that mastered them. It was in the best interest for a warlord of one group in order to lay seige upon another city-state, to persuade and rally a war spirit from the soldiers that were to kill and lose their lives for their people by stating that the absolute order came from the common worshiped diety. A God never issued such orders. Leaders did in the name of such gods to both raise warfare spirits and cement the cause.
We, as part of God, allow evil acts because we desire a change that we may think will benefit us. I have noticed that out of every bad (or evil) action, goodness arises from that action. You would have to have vision through a drinking straw not to see that.
When I claim that I am God, I am not joking. I believe each of us is also God. We are a conscience part of the universe, and in that we have power through it. To realise that you are a part of a larger whole and are able to use power from that whole is a responsibilty I am learning to handle. I've tapped into something that I have learned is easy to abuse, and I have learned what abusing it can do.
To wrap thing up: Evil exists because humanity exists to realize the concept of evil. This topic could be called "Collective Conscience and the Problem of Instinctual Nature."
I don't think there is a problem.
[This message has been edited by Cargile (edited August 29, 1999).]
OK, the idea is that God is smarter than you, and has your best intrests at heart, so if you do what He tells you to, you're gonna end up alot happier than you would otherwise. You still have your free will, and the ability to defy God, and your choice is to forget that and still do what He says.
------------------ "Don't you try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal." - Zaphod Beeblebrox, `The Restaurant at the End of the Universe'
posted
Cargile's notion actually reminds me slightly of the Minbari view of God (don't laugh). Or at least the universe.
The universe in conscious, and to explore itself, it broke apart pieces of itself, forming these bits into different things. Delenn could probably explain it much more eloquently.
We are part of the universe (God) trying to explore everything that is possible, good and bad. Or something like that.
I agree with Tora about the free will thing. If you accept that bad things happen because God doesn't interfere, then you can't say that the good things are his responsibilty too. That's having your cake and eating it.
BTW, I thought that only God was addressed as He? I thought Jesus had small-case personal pronouns?
And finally, Omega; I know you take the Bible to be true in every respect. Could you accept the possibilty of mis-translations? Of errors occuring? And if not, if you say that God would make sure that the bible was always accurate, then how do you know which of the different translations to follow?
------------------ "Ray...the next time someone asks you if you're a god you say 'Yes!'" -Winston Zeddmore
posted
Something else that piqued my attention was this:
quote:You still have your free will, and the ability to defy God, and your choice is to forget that and still do what He says.
So this means you choose to give up your free will and do what God says. Now if I'm not mistaken, that is the complete opposite of free will. Free will would be me going and doing whatever I wished, with or without the consent of God. That is free will, not negating it to do what God says regardless of how you feel.
------------------ "I see you have the ring. And that your Schwartz is as big as mine! -Dark Helmet, Spaceballs
posted
Not to drag this out but I thought I'd add, from personal experience, that a large number of Biblical literalists believe that only the King James Version is divinely inspired, and that the others vary from blasphemy to satanic influence.
------------------ "Something I can't comprehend. Something so complex and couched in its equation. So dense that light cannot escape from." -- Soul Coughing
posted
Well, Liam, a mistranslation doesn't constitute a mistake in the Bible, as I consider the Bible to be what was originally written in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic. I'm sure there's an occasional spelling error in there, but nothing that could be reasonably construed to be a contradiction to the rest. And to know which translations to follow, you have to study outside sources, and know what can be mistranslated, or translated in various ways. My particular translation has footnotes that give other possible translations for various words, which I really like.
1701:
It's still free will. It's still your choice to do whatever you want. It's just that you want to do what God says.
Sol:
I'd like to meet one of those. There arguments might be good for a laugh.
1of2:
I didn't know that. I don't use KJV much. I can hardly read it. I prefer NIV.
------------------ "Don't you try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal." - Zaphod Beeblebrox, `The Restaurant at the End of the Universe'
Of course, I'm using a little hyperbole. I don't think they claim that it's demonic on that specific page.
------------------ "Something I can't comprehend. Something so complex and couched in its equation. So dense that light cannot escape from." -- Soul Coughing
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