quote:So, it's awesome apart from 50% of the episode which was shit?
yes, but the awesome part was awesome enough to make the episode awesome despite the 50% that was shit.
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EdipisReks
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posted
quote:Originally posted by Woodside Kid: Making the E-B variant a limited-production sub-class designed for a specific type of mission would also explain why we haven't seen them more often. Realistically speaking, if the E-B's specs represented a significant upgrade to the capabilites of the class, why would Starfleet have built any old-model Excelsiors after her? Having a handful of the class retooled to do one type of job while the rest of their sisters remain general-purpose vessels makes sense to me.
yeah, that works for me too. the E-B subclass could be like the Soyuz class (i always thing of it as the "Soyuz subclass", personally). it had a specific mission, and very few of the subclass were made compred to the original. in fact, as has been speculated about the Soyuz class, perhaps most of the E-B subclass were refitted into standard ships once the specific mission qualities it had been built with were no longer needed. perhaps the Lakota was just never refit as a standard Excelsior at the time because of budget reasons, or whatever.
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Yeah, if the E-B was to be an upgrade then why didn't it stay around? I believe it's because they tried to fix something that wasn't broke and it ended up not improving anything at all.
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quote:So, it's awesome apart from 50% of the episode which was shit?
yes, but the awesome part was awesome enough to make the episode awesome despite the 50% that was shit.
Sorry, I've looked this up in the Oxford Concise English Dictionary, and your definition of "awesome episode" - an episode that is 50% shit, and 50% okay, but it's shows UTOPIA PLANITIA - is not in there.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I agree, perhaps the E-B subclass is perhaps a 'retooled' Excelsior design actively utlized to do something important enough to warrent a few different design changes and to be in production in the 42xxx era.
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Registered: Jul 2000
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Want to run by me why you don't think it was possible for the Lakota to have been a regular Excelsior at one point and refitted to E-B specs?
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Registered: Mar 1999
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EdipisReks
Ex-Member
posted
to me, that doesn't make sense if the lakota's refit during the late 24th century made it look like that. during the dominion war, the tech level difference would preclude refits looking exactly like a late 23rd century subclass . i guess it would be possible that it was upgraded after the E-B was made during the late 23rd.
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Ok, let's look at this way: Why would the Lakota be refitted from the regualr Excelsior class to the E-B subclass type which hasn't been seen since 2296?
The way I see it is of two possible theories:
1. Lakota was was a E-B subclass already, only a few are made form some reason or another, and the only big upgrade was her weapons and perhaps defensive systems.
2. The Lakota is a regular Excelsior class refitted to E-B subclass probably because of something unique to the E-B subclass that the regular Excelsior class does not have.
In either case you can probably make up your own reasons why she is upgraded to E-B specs, or a new weapons upgrade.
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Registered: Jul 2000
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I'd say that both the Ent-B and Lakota was always built to that appearance, not later modified from the std Excelsior design. The Lakota just happened to get an upgrade to her tactical systems.
The Lakota was a regular Excelsior class vessel, built in the 2340's.
After 30 years, some equipment needed to be swapped out with newer equipment. The admiralty decided to upgrade it to E-B specs so that it could perform exploratory missions. Leyton got a hold of it and got the weapons upgraded.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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EdipisReks
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posted
why would an upgrade in the 2370's look the same as a ship class from the 2290's? that makes no sense to me. we also have no evidence that excelsiors were built that late into the 24th century. i think that the Lakota started it's career in that configuration (maybe being built as late as 2315 or 20), and it will end it's career in that configuration.
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Okay, then. Let's say it's 2320, and Mirandas are still being built with the same external appearance as when they were first seen. How come they don't look like the ships of the time, ie Ambassador? I think the same thing applies here. Excelsior class ships could still be refit to E-B specs in the 24th century. The added sections on the stardrive are enhanced sensor suites, and maybe in the 24th C the saucer extensions actually are shuttlebays.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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Externally yes they look the same. I doubt internally they would be be still relying on 23rd century equipment without relying on some piece of 24th century equipment to supplement it.
Here's the thing, if you can upgrade a ship from the standard design to a new design, wouldn't you go for the most advanced you can go? I mean if Starfleet can use nearly 70 year old designs (imgaine us using 70 year old designs in our future or refitting of our modern ships/aircraft) in a large upgrade meant to make that ship far more powerful and efficient than before, then that 70 year old design must be incredibly efficient to be used in any time.
The only times I can think of that you can use that to compare to is during the Wooden Sailing ship era. A ship from 1600 can still do battle against a ship from 1700 with a chance to win. The onyl difference between those two ships is perhaps the gun design and the shape of the hull. Nothing else.
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