capped
I WAS IN THE FUTURE, IT WAS TOO LATE TO RSVP
Member # 709
posted
well maybe he was a tactical specialist.. you know, the person on the bridge isnt always the only tactical person on the ship.
in "Arena" Kirk beamed down with his top tactical officers, at the Commodore's request.. there was a redshirt, blueshirt and goldshirt if im not mistaken and none of them had regular bridge posts.. remember also that the department got shifted around sometime before the TNG days where it was united under one command, there were previously armory officers, security chiefs, tactical officers, weapons officers and even weapons crews. was the episode specific about what post he worked?
Registered: Sep 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Dat: Everyone here knows the Rutledge to be New Orleans class for which we have a canon appearance of (as the Kyushu), therefore we roughly know how big (or small) she is.
I think that that is completely a matter of perspective. "WE" really havent seen it as anymore than a blink on the screen to which you can establish a size to it whatsoever.
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Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
We do have pics of the study model used and know what scale parts of the E-D plastic models were used. From that we can estimate the general dimensions of the New Orleans class.
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Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
And this may be true to the "MODEL" but not the supposed real ship in the fantasy fleet o' trek. Granted I, like you all have my own ship list, and have gained much info for it off of here, but there are seriously some of you who go way overboard on this stuff...there is much too much speculation indicating much too much free time on some of ya'lls hands.
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Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
Granted. However, if we want to create a fictionally consistent history for O'Brien, we are already doing lots of fanwanking and using of external sources. Establishing the dimensions of the New Orleans class from a backstage photo is peanuts compared to the rest.
What I mean is, if we're not allowed to estimate the Miarecki-intended size for USS Kyushu, then we shouldn't be allowed to determine that O'Brien's old USS Rutledge was a New Orleans class vessel, either. That, too, is merely backstage info.
posted
Perhaps I missed this post, but since we are on the subject of ranks, did anyone else catch the part Data was explaining the system to Lore in "Datalore"? I believe he said: 3 years as an ensign 10-12 at lieutenant grades
Granted this hasnt been consistant over the series/years, but I thought it was an interesting tidbit.
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Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
Wasn't he specifically referring to himself?
Data is hardly the best case study you can use when looking at ranks, since he was stuck at Lt Commander longer than anyone else in the history of all mankind ever.
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Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:Data is hardly the best case study you can use when looking at ranks, since he was stuck at Lt Commander longer than anyone else in the history of all mankind ever.
Yes, but we must remember that there are those in the service, be it US Navy, Starfleet or any other military branch, that never make it to the upper ranks for whatever reasons. A lot of officers retire at LCDR or CDR and never make Captain or higher.
I agree that Data did seem at LCDR longer than anyone in the fleet, but than Riker remaind CDR (or First Officer, especially for a man who wanted nothing but a ship of his own) for the longest time as well.
posted
I always figured that Data stayed a Lt. Com. because he wasn't in the command division and really had no desire to be. His rank was completely adequate for his duties and there likely would be no reason to promote him.
Other officers have lamented the limits of wearing a gold uniform, specifically Edington.
Now, there have been certain case where we've seen Data promoted to a higher rank or position. Riker thought about making him first officer in Best of Both Worlds. Jellico put him in a red uniform in Chain of Command. He assumed command of the ship in The Gambit. He was given command of a ship in Unification. Etc. So it's not like he is unqualified to perform command duties, he simply never wanted to pursue that field, I think.
Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
The limits of the gold uniform have been debated before. We have seen a Vice Admiral in those colors ("The Die is Cast") and there were many Commodores in the comparable red shirt in TOS. Eddington's comments might have been directed at the position of a starship captain rather than the rank of Captain...
There is probably more complexity in there than we really want to know about. For example, the progression up the rank ladder might be variable depending on the lifespan of your species - an immortal android isn't in much of a hurry, nor is a Vulcan, so they might not follow the human norm even in a human-dominated organization. OTOH, an Ocampa might receive promotions every second week.
Saiyanman Benjita
...in 2012. This time, why not the worst?
Member # 122
posted
I get a headache just thinking about O'Brien's rank status.
However, in the case of Data (and probably the Vulcans), you also have to think of personality as a possible reason that he has spent so much time in the lieutenant grades (though he probably includes all 3 "lieutenant" grades (JG, Lieutenant, LC)). Remember that ambition is a human emotion. Riker shows this early in the series when he talks about being the youngest captain. This would lead you to believe that he is still young, perhaps 28-31, and is looking to be a captain by 33. His ambition probably led him to put himself in a position to be promoted as early as possible. However, Data, having little ambition (he doesn't have NONE, or else he'd just be another robot), probably led him to keep the status quo. This will pass him over come promotion time almost any time. Data's promotions probably were timed at near the greatest intervals because of his lack of ambition. This is probably the same deal with Vulcans.
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Registered: Apr 1999
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posted
I don't think that Lieutenant Commander is a "lietenant" rank, any more than sergeant major is a "sergeant" rank.
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
Registered: Mar 1999
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Saiyanman Benjita
...in 2012. This time, why not the worst?
Member # 122
posted
True, true. My point was more on the ambition part. His ambition lies in the human being, and little more. When you haven't much ambition, you'll take less risks. Less risks mean less payoff, and a longer term in the lower grades. The "By the book" captains tend to get there at later ages.
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Registered: Apr 1999
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