posted
Very nice that they add 1701A-style nacelles, and those weapon stations look interesting. Fast-acquisition targeting, I assume. They had that already back in DS9 on those station-turrets, weird that they never used that again, since it was state-of-the-art Federation tech.
The engineering hull looks very uparmored, I wonder if they will use the magic word when discussing it. Also, the saucer shape clearly looks Excelsior-inspired, since it doesn't hace a concave rim taper. I like it.
Like I heard elsewhere, it makes sense that it would be built in a sort of knee-jerk reaction to the Nero incident, like with the 9/11 fallout.
[ April 24, 2013, 08:48 AM: Message edited by: Nim ]
Registered: Aug 1999
| IP: Logged
As someone at SSM pointed out, the ship was designed by Abrams.
Sorry, but that can't be right. Abrams is a film director, not a starship designer. Undoubtedly this is just more hearsay from Abrams-haters.
This ship has John Eaves written all over it, from the holes in the saucer to the clearly 24th century design. While Eaves himself is a very nice guy, his ship designs all tend to look the same no matter what time period they are supposed to be from.
Do I like this ship? Well, no, not really. I didn't like the nuEnterprise either. Am I going to let it detract from my enjoyment of the movie? Not at all.
-------------------- "A film made in 2008 isn't going to look like a TV series from 1966 if it wants to make any money. As long as the characters act the same way, and the spirit of the story remains the same then it's "real" Star Trek. Everything else is window dressing." -StCoop
Registered: Jun 2000
| IP: Logged
Since even the high res pic is VERY dark, here's a lightened version to show some more of the EVIL SHIP. You know it's EVIL since it's dark grey. http://i.imgur.com/x1pGCoa.jpg
That is one seriously ugly fucking design- worse than the worse FASA design...I mean, look at that secondary hull! Someone said it looks like a Michael Bay Decepticon design and IO have to agree.
WUURRGGGGHHHHH! Wow, I was just sick a tiny bit looking at that.
-------------------- I have plenty of experience in biology. I bought a Tamagotchi in 1998... And... it's still alive.
Registered: Apr 2005
| IP: Logged
WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
posted
UGGHH. That looks like one of those horrible spaceship paintings that used to be on the Star Trek books from the 70's.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged
posted
Having digested (and re-digested) that picture, the following musings have coallesed in my mind.
Why does it have a fecking great hole in it - what advantage does that confer?
Why so big? A black ops ship that big can hardly sneak around and would be difficult to disguise in a ship yard or other facility.
What are the testi for? Guns presumably.
Do the rail guns come out of the glowing tonsil, or the two apparent ports behind the cut out?
Are all of the escape podesque hatches concealing guns?
Why is the secondary hull built out of lego?
Are those four torpedo bays above the deflector?
Is the lack of windows, hatches etc, stylistic (its a black ops ship, so they are an unneeded frill)? Or is it a scaling thing?
I truely am intrigued by this ugly behemoth. I want to see what it can do (though I expect it will be way over the top, after all they have to outdo the last film) and I want to know the story finally.
However (and this could change when I see the film) the design really does not fit in "my" Star Trek universe, even post TNG. We shall see, but I agree with all of those who liken it to a mad fan boy doodle in their school book. Not my cup of tea at all.
-------------------- I have plenty of experience in biology. I bought a Tamagotchi in 1998... And... it's still alive.
Registered: Apr 2005
| IP: Logged
posted
Why in hell would any Trek ship have railguns...aside from the "JJ thought they looked kewel on NuBSG"...
Blerg.
The ship looking like ass is severely disapopinting but Cummerbach is still getting my money- I really enjoied the Sherlock TV show and he looks to have really beefed up for this role as well- I think he's got the acting chops to be a great Trek villian.
Of course, so did Eric Bana. And Tom Hardy Abd F. Murray Abraham And Malcolm McDowell, for fuck's sake.
Trek really knows how to piss away some great acting potential in it's villians, y'know that?
Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
-------------------- “Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.” — Isaac Asimov Star Trek Minutiae | Memory Alpha
Registered: Nov 2000
| IP: Logged
posted
The Twitter stream is indeed hilarious, but I think there are some hints dropped in there. Seems quite obvious to me that Harrison is an Augment.
-------------------- I haul cardboard and cardboard accessories
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
posted
So, um, in case anyone wants to read a synopsis...
Five minutes before entering Pike's office, Kirk had been skipping along after Spock saying, "Yeah, we're cool. I haven't lost a single man. Pike's gonna give us the five year mission" and the meeting with Pike completely bursts his bubble. When Spock is dismissed from Pike's office and he talks to Kirk alone, he really rips into him, in a different take to the one we saw in the trailers. He's really angry, but you realise that Pike sees Kirk almost as a son and feels he can do much better. Kirk's command is ripped away, they give the Enterprise back to Pike, Spock is assigned to the USS Bradbury. Kirk leaves with his tail between his legs. Greenwood was fantastic in this scene. The movie really started here for me. . . . Er, yes, it's Kirk and Spock's hands on the glass. Yes, BC is Khan. Yes, Marcus is Section 31 Black ops.
There's another fantastic scene between Pike and Kirk the bar. Kirk is completely gutted an Pike tells him he asked for him as first officer aboard the Enterprisr, because he believes in him. Apparently he really had to go to bat with Admiral Marcus for the appointment.
Back in London, we all know Khan's blood saves the dying child and he enlists the father to bomb the Starfleet Data Archive. All the captains and first officers meet at Starfleet headquarters to plan strategy. Marcus reports that it was Harrison, and ex Sect 31 black ops specialist. Kirk is looking at vids from the bombing, and in a very cool extreme Google Earth kind of thing, he zooms in on Harrison. Kirk starts to ask why Harrison would bother to bomb a Data Archive when he knows all th material is n public record and starts to question the real motive, but for once he's unsure of himself and shuts up. Marcus has to wheedle it out of him. . . . Kirk realises its just a ploy to get everyone together in the one room just as Harrison shows up to blow them all to Kingdom Come. Pike is badly injured, Spock runs to help him while Kirk picks up a gun and starts firing away at Harrison's ship, then throws some sort of piece of metal on the end of a fire hose thing into the ships vent, sending it crashing down, but not before they get a look at each other. As Pike gasps his last Breath, Spock melds with him. Kirk runs over and sees Pike is dead and bursts into tears, literally sobbing uncontrollably with Spock looking on. It's a very Powerful scene. It feels like that is Kirk experiencing the loss of his father. . . . They find out that Harrison has fled to Kronos, in Klingon space, "The one place we cannot go." But Kirk insists on being allowed to go after him. So they devise a plan to travel to the edge of the Neutral Zone and Marcus organises for Kirk to carry a payload of advanced torpedoes that they have been developing. They beam them all aboard Enterprise, but Scotty won't sign off on the manifest because their shielding means he can't scan them to see what's inside. Therefore he refuses to have them aboard his ship because he doesn't know what danger they present. He also has a philosophical problem with the torpedoes and challenges Kirk. He doesn't like the military op. He wants to know if they are still explorers. Kirk orders him and he refuses, saying Kirk will have to fire him. So he does. Kirk appoints Chekov as Chief engineer and tells him to go get a red shirt. We all squeal. Scotty leaves the ship . . . Spock/Uhura are fighting. It's almost like a teenage spat. Spock is seriously having girl trouble. Uhura's mad at him because she thinks he doesn't feel. That he endangers his life without a thought about how it affects him. It's not unlike the accusations Kirk was hurling at Spock earlier. Calling him a traitor and a robot. She's pretty snitty and they have a bit of an argument on the way to Kronos with Kirk reluctantly in the middle. Then Spock suddenly reveals that he does feel. He recounts feeling Pike's death - the pain, the fear, the loneliness. He says he felt a similar thing at the death of Vulcan. He never wants to have to feel like that again. We see Kirk and Uhura both rect, chagrined. They have been unfair on Spock. On a side note, Uhura seems to really like Kirk now. She worries about him a lot. There is also a lot of touching. Everyone is always caressing everyone else. Lots of closeups of hands on arms or shoulders. Fanfic, here we come. . . . Sorry, just trying to say things the way they happened because it's more engaging that way. Just a fact dump is not going to be very fair to the movie.
In Engineering, Chekov discovers some weird fault or anomaly with the engines and Kirk instructs him to work on it. He leaves Sulu in command, and Sulu broadcasts to the surface that he has a whole pile of high-powered torpedoes pointing at them. Uhura goes with Kirk and Spock in the shuttle to find Harrison. She speaks Klingon, so this actually makes sense. After a StarWars-esque chase, the Klingons outnumber our galant trio but then Harrison shows up and starts wiping the floor with them all. He then walks up to Kirk and Kirk just lays into him (very neanderthal) and the blows just bounce off Harrison. Then Kirk decides he's not going to kill him, but take him into custody so he can stand trial on behalf of Admiral Pike.
I forgot to mention, a weapons specialist called Carol Wallace has joined the Enterprise to look after the torpedoes. Spock is suspicious and runs her data. Discovers Wallace is her mother's name. She's Marcus' daughter. I am getting a little confused about the scene order, but they decide to beam one of the torpedoes down to some planet to see what's inside. McCoy goes with Carol, but when the torpedo arms and catches McCoys arm in it, he screams at them to beam Carol up to save her, but she bravely stays to try and disarm it, sort of winning their trust. She yanks loose some big component, the outer casing slides open, and of course inside is a cryotube with a frozen body. Back on the ship, Harrison asks Kirk how many torpedoes they have and they tell him, they have a payload of 72. Isn't that how many cryotube turns were aboard the Botany Bay? . . . Kirk asks Harrison who he is really. He replies that he was a product of genetic engineeriing from 300 years ago and says his name is Khan (audience whoops, groans, cheers). He starts to cleverly bait Kirk, saying that Marcus scanned space for their vessel then revived Khan and held his crews' lives over his head, forcing him to work for them, develop superior weaponry etc. He asks, is there nothing you wouldn't do for your crew, Captain? This gets Kirk in his Achilles heel. He obviously has separation issues and doesn't want to lose a single member of his little family. Bones takes some of Khan's blood and injects it into a dead Tribble.
Then Marcus shows up in a huge Dreadnaught-class ship. He tells Kirk that Khan is manipulating him and is surprised that Kirk didn't kill him. Kirk is suspicious of Marcus and won't hand Khan over. Says he's gonna take him back to Earth to stand trial. Marcus targets Enterprise and starts blowing them out of the sky. Kirk pleads for the lives of his crew, offers his life in their place, but Marcus just wants to destroy them. Carol jumps in so her father knows she's aboard, hoping that will stop the slaughter, but he just beams her aboard, then just as the Enterprise is about to be blown away, the Dreadnaught's weapons go offline. Scotty has smuggled himself aboard and is in control of the engineering deck. By communicator, Kirk decides to space jump aross with Khan with Scotty opening the port at his end. I the meantime Spock calls New Vulcan... . . . Spock Prime appears on the view screen. Young Spock asks if, in his travels, they ever encountered a character called Khan? Spock Prime replies that Spock knows he swore he would never reveal details of their lives, but Khan was the most dangerous foe they ever faced and would kill them all without a thought. Spock asks whether they were able to defeat him and Spock Prime replies, "at great cost". . . . Just as Spock is hearing of Khan's treachery on the Enterprise, Khan escapes from Kirk on the Dreadnaught. To cut a long story short... A big space batltle ensues, with Khan demanding that the cryotubes be beamed aboard the Dreadnaught, but Spock is a step ahead of him and Bones has removed the Cryotubes and Spock has armed the torpedoes, so they blow a hole in the Dreadnaught and as Khan plummets towards Earth (did I mention he had pursued them at Warp back to Earth? ) he aims the dying ship at Starfleet Academy to wipe them out. But the Enterprise is also in trouble. The Warp core is offline and the area is irradiated with no way to fix it. So begins the final scenes of TWOK, in reverse, even with most of the same dialogue. Kirk goes into the chamber / giant beer factory, with Scotty screaming after him, gets the core back on line, Spock defeats Khan then gets a frantic message from Scott that he'd better get down there.
It's a lovely death scene, really. Poor Spock/Quinto is inconsolable. There is a lot of crying in this movie. Kirk dies. . . . Now you can guess what happens after that, can't you? We certainly did. And it did.
I'm getting pretty punchy. Might go and have a look at some of the other reviews and head to bed.
My impression was that, at first I thought all the Kirk/Spock Logic vs Feeling argument was a bit simplistic, but over the course of the movie, it played out beautifully with some great lines, and lots of emotion/tears. Similarly, the Kirk/Pike scenes are all wonderful.I think people will find the emotional component of this movie satisfying.
The effects are often brilliant, but I wasn't a fan of the 3D at all. At first it was cumbersome and distracting and after that I got used to it, but it doesn't really bring anything extra to the movie.
As for the parts of the plot that are rehashed from TOS prime universe. For a moment there, we got a bit excited that they were going to put a whole different twist on them, but it just wasn't enough of a twist, which left the end of the movie a bit predictable and flat. They perhaps should have branched into more unknown territory.
But as a movie about family, arguing and fighting but getting to know and trust and value each other, it was really lovely. It was certainly action-packed. If TWOK was a 9/10 and ST09 was an 8/10, I'd probably give this a 7, mostly for the raw emotion of the performances.
I hope that satisfies the hunger for this evening.
Yes, it's a Section 31 black ops warship commanded by Admiral Marcus with a bunch of nifty superweapons. The Klingons are becoming extremely aggressive and Starfleet needs a way to stop them, so Section 31 develops this massive ship (presumably reverse engineered from scans of Nero's ship the Narada).
Then using information given to Starfleet by SpockPrime, because he was worried about them encountering Khan without warning, Admiral Marcus searches for and finds the Botany Bay sometime after the events of the first movie. They thaw Khan (Cumberbatch) from cryosleep, and force him to assist them as an agent of Starfleet with the alias of John Harrison or else they'll kill his 72 surviving followers still in cryosleep.
John Harrison by the way is a combination of the original three names for Khan in the early drafts of Space Seed. He was first named Harold Erricson. Then he took on the alias of John Ericson while trying to conceal his true identity.
John + Harold Erricson becomes John Harrison in STiD.
Anyway, Kirk first battles Admiral Marcus, but later spacejumps over to the ship with Harrison/Khan to capture it. At this point Kirk doesn't know Khan's identity and thinks Marcus is the greater threat. But once Harrison captures the ship, he reveals his identity to Kirk and a running battle ensues at warp with Khan pursuing Kirk all the way back to Earth, which is where the scenes of the USS Vengeance crashing and the Enterprise falling in the atmosphere take place.
Kirk takes the place of Spock and sacrifices himself TWoK style to save the ship at the last moment. He dies of radiation exposure. However, Khan's blood (which they tested earlier) has regenerative powers, and it's hinted at the end of the film that Kirk will be revived.
-------------------- I haul cardboard and cardboard accessories
Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged
WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
posted
Now I think I have a headache after that spoiler.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged
posted
So, does the Vengeance have a registry? Any other Starfleet vessels in the movie?
-------------------- "Never give up. And never, under any circumstances, no matter what - never face the facts." - Ruth Gordon
Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged
posted
Yeah, I'm really trying to stay spoiler free until I see the movie, but I wouldn't mind knowing about any other ships.
I did see a Newton-type ship docked at the Starbase in one of the trailers with "NCC-071x," with the "x" being either a 2, 3, 5, 6, 8, 9, or B
-------------------- "A film made in 2008 isn't going to look like a TV series from 1966 if it wants to make any money. As long as the characters act the same way, and the spirit of the story remains the same then it's "real" Star Trek. Everything else is window dressing." -StCoop
Registered: Jun 2000
| IP: Logged
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic