posted
The Al-Batani... Actually - I just deleted what I was going to say about Janeway/Paris' Father being on the Al-Batani and WOLF-359 - Both could have moved on since their mission together aboard that ship - Janeway to another ship and Paris onto Admiral.
Just about the Akira, Steamrunner, Sabre and Norway... I reckon that they are older ships... I have resigned myself to that fact after quite a long time... BUT I needed to explain why they had 'modern' E-E markings. The Borg incursion in FC, seem to indicate it took place near Earth. I reckon these ships were either 1. Stocked in Sector 001 for such an event. 2. In Sector 001 going undergoing their upgrade/refit to E-E type systems/markings etc.
Seeing as we never saw the Norway again, I reckon it was a 'mothballed' prototype kept in Sector 001.
The Akira might have had older features like escape-pods/nacelles etc. Maybe something akin to the Ambassador class. Same for the Steamrunner. The bussard collectors on this one look similar to the E-C's...
The Sabre on the otherhand I think - due to its size and similar configuration (except this one sticks with the nacelles-at-a-distance stlye) - is one of the Borg Weapons that were under development by Shelby and co. I think that after the success of the Defiant's ironing out by Chief O'Brien, that they decided to get these babies out too... ESPECIALLY when they needed something smaller against the Jem'hadar.
So basically these four types of ships were on hand in Sector 001. There was only the Bozeman and a nebbie around as 'other' ships that we've seen.
(I think the Bozeman is stalking the Enterprise) ;o)
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Don't worry about the small Sovereign-likeness of the Akira, Norway, Sabre, and Steamrunner.
Remember that the Niagara, Challanger, New Orleans, Nebula, et al... came before the Galaxy. They have Galaxy-like markings too.
-------------------- Later, J _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ _ The Last Person to post in the late Voyager Forum. Bashing both Voyager, Enterprise, and "The Bun" in one glorious post.
posted
The real problem is that the Steamrunner in turn came before the Challenger, New Orleans, Springfield, Nebula etc... That is, if you believe age can be determined from the registries. I do.
I wouldn't sweat the markings, since they can be easily repainted. But I would encourage Mojo to try out some variety in this respect. For example, recent-manufacture ships of Galaxy or Nebula class could have Sovereign-style pennant graphics. Or an old Steamrunner could have a color scheme similar to that of the Galaxies, instead of the standard rather dark grey.
I'd hate to label the Sabres as Borg-killers, however. We do have some 61k range registry evidence, which should be well before "Q Who?". And contrary to Encyclopedia graphics, these ships are relatively large. I'd assume experimental anti-Borg vessels to start small. The Sabre seems like a simple continuation of the Steamrunner design lineage - perhaps a dead end, perhaps the next primary lineage of Starfleet?
posted
Isn't it a little strange that lots of these four types of ships came out for the Borg battle in FC?? That's why I thought they may have been in for refit/mothballed. Maybe they were ships that were mothballed AFTER all the mothballed ships from the best of both worlds were destroyed - lots of empty storage space? MAYBE They were retired after the Cardassian wars... and stored. And they had recently been reactivated because of the Dominion threat and have been slowly undergoing refit (using of course the new tech that we see featured on the EE.). It just seems strange having LOTS of 4 types of ships and only 1 Sovereign, 1 Miranda and 1 Nebula.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Alternate theory: most of the ship types seen here were optimized for large-scale warfare and were not very practical at deep-space exploration. Hence, our heroes would not come to contact with them until this time of conflict.
Perhaps all these fancy multi-shuttlebay designs were built for planetary assault roles, and a fleet of them was amassing at Earth in order to fight the Dominion. The Steamrunners don't seem to have any other more plausible role - they don't seem to be able to fire torpedoes, so they suck at ship-to-ship; they don't withstand hits from Borg weapons quite as well as some elderly Mirandas do; and they have a minimal number of phaser strips awkwardly placed. But they do have a freaking big shuttlebay that apparently takes up most of the interior, judging by the placement of the doors.
posted
How can you say that they don't take hits as well as Mirandas!?! Who knows how long those Steamrunners were battling the Borg before the Miranda turned up!?! For all we know they could have been the first starships on the scene and lasted the longest.
Have we ever seen a nice clear shot of the bottom of them? Who knows where Torpedoes could emerge from!?! ;o)
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
I like the idea that those "bad-ass" starships were like in storage and hence were not seen for a lot of the time. since Starfleet isnt primarily a military organization (if i'm completely off the mark some one hit me ) anyway, since there were no major wars which were shown onscreen prior to the jem-hadar, then we would not have seen these starships designed to fight. That may explain the different designs compared with the explorers we were used to. Which may also explain the reason why Archer's enterprise looks the way it does and has all that offensive equipment... since they needed to protect themselves while they 'looked around'
i dunno that just my thawts on the subject.
If my, ideas were somehow ripped off someone else i'm sorry!
-------------------- "Tom is Canadian. He thereby uses advanced humour tecniques, such as 'irony', 'sarcasm', and werid shit'. If you are not qualified in any of these, it will be risky for you to attempt to decipher what he means. Just smile and carry on." - PsyLiam; 16th June
Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
You know, I would really love to see a clear picture of the Akira, Steamrunner, and Saber undersides. We've had the tops, well how about the bottoms? Perhaps Mojo can help with this?
I too think that the FC ships have been around for some time. Many reasons have already been given and I'm inclined to go with the theory that the ships were refit, at least to some extent anyway, before FC.
As for the Bozeman - I have a theory that the Soyuz-class is simply a subclass of the Mirandas, hence the similarities. So the Bozeman always really was a Miranda in essence. Anyway, I believe that the Bozeman was refit to the Miranda baseline and that's the ship we see in Generations (at the end), and in First Contact (up against the cube). Just a nice theory that happens to fit the facts we know.
posted
My opinion of the Bozeman was that she was not the Miranda class - she either wasn't there, or was another class of ship. We only know that a Bozeman was there, mostly at the behest of the writer whose hometown it is. There's no evidence either way, so...
The most detailed pics of the Akira class online are probably here:
Unfortunately, there has *never* been a good shot of the underside of a Steamrunner, Saber or Norway onscreen. The ST:M has underside schematics of the first two, but their authenticity is often held in dispute due to this lack of onscreen evidence.
Regarding the rest of the FC designs, it is likely that they were refitted with extra stuff, though not necessarily just for FC - it could have simply been planned upgrades to the whole class to give the Akira and Steamrunner the FC-era escape pods. Of the four, it's possible that the only "Borg Buster" besides the Defiant was the Norway class, since we've never seen them anywhere else. Perhaps the Norway was a limited-production class that was refit into a Borg Buster in favour of building a whole new class of ship - or to complement the limited-production Defiant class.
Mark
[ January 25, 2002, 08:51: Message edited by: Mark Nguyen ]
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I WAS IN THE FUTURE, IT WAS TOO LATE TO RSVP
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posted
Not that its worth anything in studio terms, but in the novel 'Ship of the Line', the Bozeman was depicted as being reactivated for service, i.e. the Bozeman mentioned in 'Generations' was the Soyuz-class vessel. It was retired shortly after that at Starbase 12, where it is now a museum piece. Morgan Bateson took charge of the Sovereign-class development project, along with SCE Captain Montgomery Scott. Bateson requested command of the E-E, since JL Picard was on a long term secret mission in Cardassian space. After command of the Enterprise was given to Jean-Luc Picard (who returned after a standoff during the E-E's shakedown), Bateson was honored with a new command, the Norway-class U.S.S. Bozeman (a hastily renamed U.S.S. Roderick).. and since the ship was renamed, it carried a NCC-1941-A registry. This would then be the Borg-battle Bozeman, commanded by the Kelsey Grammar voiceover cameo
I like Diane Carey's Treks so this is how I see it.
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posted
Ship of the Line was awesome! it wasn't Carey's best, she seems to shine the most with her own characters, but it certainly got the feel of the new ship right. It was a little oddly plotted at the resolution, but it stil lshines superior compared to some of the crap that comes out from Pocket with ST written on the front
Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
I didn't like it. For some odd reason, many Pocket authors like to try to isolate people aboard starships alone, with a less-than-skeleton crew aboard. This is the case in "Ship of the Line", when the E-E ends up with next to no one aboard for extended periods of time. This is a silly trend, visible in nother novels like "Saratoga", "Ashes of Eden", and "Crossover" among them.
posted
Age of the FC ships: I can live with these being older than the E-D. You could say that they were originally standard explorer types but were refitted with updated technology, either in responce to the borg or not, it doesn't really matter. It would be interesting to see someome come up with a TNG era version of these ships.
Boezman: I kind of like the idea that the last of the Soyuz-class is still milling about the place. Remember that it was fresh out of the docks before it became trapped in the causality loop, so it was technically still brand new. If you recall Geordie's comments in "Relics", its not inconcevable that a 23rd century ship could opperate in the 24th century, all it would need is a few months getting a few minor systems refited.
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