Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
Funny I see this right at the moment. Guess what's the next ship on my 'to do'-list for the size comparison chart? Right.
One thing I noticed; using the factfiles-schematic (corrected or not), the ship would be 580m long. For my first comparison I used the Galaxy-nacelles, but then I noticed the secondary hull is Ambassador. So I took the 526m-Ambassador as a reference. And the 580m-Niagara was the result. Otherwise, I got something around 500m. What do you think? Galaxy-nacelles or Ambassador-hull? (Furthermore, the whole saucer dome is just the standard-Ambassador's, turned 180�. And the saucer seems to be an Ambassador-modification, too.)
While currently at it, what about the Freedom-class? Here I wanted to use the Galaxy-nacelle-comparison, too. We'd get a 400-something scale. But the factfiles-schematic showed only a five-deck connecting dorsal. Going that way (I don't know where the ff get their info, but we have to assume they have some sort of insider information on it) we'd get a 230m-Freedom. First, the ship looked fake being that small, but assuming it's some sort of destroyed like Hermes and friends, the size would be perfect.
So? What should I do? (Sorry Mim for using your topic for it, but it fits in here. )
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Registered: Nov 2001
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Well, given the number of Ambassador parts on the Niagara, I'd use those for the scale. After all, we already know that Galaxy-style nacelles come in all shapes and sizes.
As for the Freedom... What are the choices we have? Normal Galaxy/Nebula nacelle, Niagara nacelle, or Challenger nacelle (assuming this isn't the same size as one of the others). I'd say go w/ the one that looks best. :-)
Registered: Mar 1999
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The only part of that ship that comes from the Amnassador is the secondary hull. The nacelles come off the 2-foot Galaxy, the pylons are custom-made. The saucer is in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY derived from an Ambassador. It's elliptical and quite Galaxy-like, and doesn't appear to be too far out of scale with regular Galaxy nacelles. Pay no mind to the FF schematics, look at the studio model. The bridge looks to be custom-made, too, thought I can see the resemblance to an Ambassador module.
And, as far as I know, the only time we've seen Galaxy-like nacelles that don't appear to be regular sized is on the New Orleans, (where they are "stretched") which is scaled to be a smaller ship. The Niagara, Freedom, and Nebula all have the same scale nacelles as the Galaxy.
-MMoM
[ February 23, 2002, 18:10: Message edited by: The Mighty Monkey of Mim ]
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Registered: Jun 2001
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I don't think the assertion that the Niagara parts came from the "3-foot Ambassador" and "2-foot Galaxy" is true. For one thing, the Ambassador studio model was 41", which is closer to 3.5 feet. And a two-foot Galaxy's nacelles would be way too tiny compared to that. Or even to a 3-footer, for that matter. I would guess the nacelles had to come from the 4-foot Galaxy. As I understand, it was built for the third season, so wouldn't it have been around by the time of the filming of the TBoBW graveyard scene? Even if it wasn't completely finished, the mold could still have been already in existence.
Now, the ratio between a 48-inch Galaxy and a 41-inch Ambassador is about 1.17:1. The ratio between a 643m Galaxy and a 526m Ambassador is about 1.22:1. So, if we assume the Niagara has a normal Ambassador sec. hull, the nacelles are about 96% the size of normal Galaxy nacelles. So, if we wanted to, I suppose we could say that the model was actually inaccurate, and the Niagara has both normal Galaxy nacelles and a normal Ambassador sec. hull.
Registered: Mar 1999
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I've also just been thinking about the Challenger. Since the Cheyenne, New Orleans, and Springfield were all made using 1:2500-scale saucers w/ 1:1400-scale bridge modules, we can (and do) assume that the bridge modules are normal Galaxy size, and the saucers are scaled down to 56% of normal Galaxy size. If the Challenger also follows this same scaling set-up, we have two options for the nacelles. Either they were taken from the 1:1400 model, making them the same scale as the bridge and therefore normal Galaxy size, or they were taken from the two-foot model, making them about 130% of normal Galaxy size.
[ February 23, 2002, 21:55: Message edited by: TSN ]
Registered: Mar 1999
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
Hey, I'm going to upload my shipscale-list today, including two large charts of all the federation classes.
For now, I took the (uncorrected) Niagara-schematic - Ambassador size. Maybe I'll redo the nacelles-part. What I can say is I had to redo both Nebula-Melbourne (you can clearly see from the pictures at EAS that the small nacelles are attached to the base of the weapons-pod phylon and not to the secondary hull) and Shelley (I have a dozen different schematics of that ship, and all look different. So I decided to do my own version of the truth. ) The Freedom is at the moment at ~ 230m (going with the windows), but maybe I'll change that. Maybe there's another base for the Freedom-scaling. As mentioned above, the Niagara's and Ambassador's bridge dome module thing (the part on top of the saucer) is the same used for the Freedom. Niagara's main body and dome are of the same scale, meaning I could use the dome of the Niagara to scale the Freedom. (I did basically the same when figuring out the size of the Springfield, allthough I used the Cheyenne-nacelles as reference.) Let's see how much time I got at hand today and tell me what exactly has to be altered on the FactFiles schematic. The redone nacelle phylons are one thing already done. I'll rescale the nacelles. What else?
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Registered: Nov 2001
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
Here it is, my size comparison chart. The two pictures are accessable by clicking the links on top of the page, as is the updated starship chart.
QSF, please!
Oh! Forgot one thing: The corrected chart with the redone Niagara will be uploaded later today. If you want the seperate Shelley/Melbourne/Unknown1-drawings, tell me and I upload them.
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Registered: Nov 2001
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Here's a thought: How big would the Freedom be if we made it's nacelle the same size as the mini-nacelles on the Melbourne?
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Registered: Mar 1999
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
First we need the actual size of the Melbourne nacelles. The ship itself is the 1/1400 kit and the nacelles are the 1/2500-kit. The nacelles of the Galaxy should be 245m. Scaled down it should be 17,5cm for the 1400-kit. For the 2500-kit, it would be 9,8cm. the 9,8 upscaled with 1400 we get 137,2m-auxiliary nacelles. (Always assuming the 245m are the real size, not 247m or 244m and the model kit dimensions are the right ones given at the EAS.) The entire ship would then be ~ 230m long. Interestingly, that's nealy the same size I got when I took the 5-deck connecting dorsal.
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Registered: Nov 2001
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I'm the one who built all these ships, (Niagara, Freedom, Springfield, Challenger, Melbourne, New Orleans, etc) a while back, in conjunction with Bernd, and fellow members of the ASDB.
This was the final Niagara version...
At the time I fixed the over all length of her to be 415M. It doesn't mean that's right though, and the Freedom came out at 259M. The Niagara saucer is in fact circular, not elliptical, that's what we established.
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