quote:Originally posted by Ryan McReynolds: I believe it's pretty firmly established that there were lines added after the pilots, but they were done in pencil only and nearly invisible. There are shots on a couple of the various modelling reference sites that show the lines, and the fact that they aren't seen in others just demonstrates their faintness. There isn't really any other explanation for them ever being visble, unless it's a vast conspiracy to deceive nerds everywhere.
Yes. As far as the top of the saucer goes, that is true. The guy who built the model (his name escapes me at the moment) said he didn't put any gridlines on the ship and that they weren't on it when he modified it for the second pilot either, but rather that someone drew them on in pencil during the first season of production on the series. Therefore, the two pilot versions should not have gridlines, but the series version should. Actually, more what I was confused about was whether or not there should be gidlines on the ventral side of the saucer, as I never seem to remember seeing those until they were either darkened or just plain added by Ed Miarecki when he did the repainting of the model for the Smithsonian's 1991 "restoration" of the ship. I still haven't quite figured out which it was.
quote:Originally posted by CaptainMike: i hope we are going into this with the awareness that the dimensions of the Franz Joseph blueprints are completely dissimilar to the dimensions of any of the models used to represent the Enterprise in TOS, right?
Yes, absolutely. I am postulating that the Constitution in fact was structured just as FJ drew it, and then the Enterprise and other ships sported individual modifications in design as they were constructed, similar to how present-day navies operate, and just as we have seen in Trek with ships like the Excelsior and Enterprise-B.
posted
Ah, I just found this pic which shows that the series model did have gridlines on the underside as well, just very very faint.
Of course, now I'm finding myself questioning those concentric lines around the hull and nacelles.
Damn, Miarecki did a really totally utterly f*cked up paintjob on the model for that 1991 renovation. Why the HELL did he over-emphasize and darken everything like that?
In case anyone doesn't know what I'm talking about, look here.
-MMoM
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posted
Wow, sorry about posting so many replies in a row, but it's really been quite a while in between...
Anyway, Rev, I've just been informed of an important note. The nacelles of the AMT model, aka the Constellation, do in fact taper somewhat. To be exact, they taper from 25mm at the forward end to 23mm at the rear end. That's the cylinders themselves, without the caps or ends on.
I'm talking to some folks on the TrekBBS and the Starshipbuilder boards and I'm trying to get some accurate specs for the dimensions/proportions of the old AMT model.
And, I'll try to do those scans of the FJ plans and send them to Bernd for cleanup tomorrow or the next day.
Good night. -MMoM
-------------------- The flaws we find most objectionable in others are often those we recognize in ourselves.
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The left picture here also implies the existence of bottom saucer grid lines, unless they were added in one of the earlier restorations (which seems a bit unlikely).
Also something that I keep forgetting to ask. Why exactly did we never see those patterns on the bottom of the ship on the show?
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They also seem to be on the 3 foot model in this picture. Or my mind is playing up.
The 3 footer appears to be in "series" form there. I never realised that was also modified from it's pilot form. Were both the small and large ships made into all 3 versions, or not?
-------------------- Yes, you're despicable, and... and picable... and... and you're definitely, definitely despicable. How a person can get so despicable in one lifetime is beyond me. It isn't as though I haven't met a lot of people. Goodness knows it isn't that. It isn't just that... it isn't... it's... it's despicable.
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quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: Also something that I keep forgetting to ask. Why exactly did we never see those patterns on the bottom of the ship on the show?
Simply because they're too faint to show up on TV.
quote:The 3 footer appears to be in "series" form there. I never realised that was also modified from it's pilot form. Were both the small and large ships made into all 3 versions, or not?
I don't know if the 3-ft model ever existed in "The Cage" style, but it did in the WNMHGB style and in the series style. The 11-ft model was all three.
-MMoM
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the small model was most visibly seen as the shrunken 1701 in "Requiem for Methuselah.." presumably modified to match the large..
how much of it can we see in the post-pilot photosessions, where Kirk and Spock are holding the ship?
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I already said that the 3-footer existed in 2nd pilot and series-style versions. I just don't know if it was ever in 1st pilot mode. (Which it probably wasn't, as I think there are only like 2 shots of the ship's exterior in "The Cage," so they probably didn't require 2 models at that point. It was probably built during production of WNMHGB.)
-MMoM
-------------------- The flaws we find most objectionable in others are often those we recognize in ourselves.
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For those of you who care, I added an insert showing just how much detail is going into this. As you can see the sauser is complete, the nacelle is half done and I've made a start on the engineering hull.
Mim: How would you like the port-side view handled? Considering that the actual model was more or less bare on that side with the exception of a few wires and some masking tape.
posted
Obviously, this is Mim's gig, but I'd suggest mirroring the starboard side, simply because the port side was generally only shown through mirror-labeled text on the starboard side and reversing the film. The bare port side (and the gaping hole in it) are, essentially, non-canon.
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