posted
Not recently. I'm waiting for the release of Season 2 to get more information.
-------------------- "Never give up. And never, under any circumstances, no matter what - never face the facts." - Ruth Gordon
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I know you're probably swamped with many projects, but I found a bit of useful information regarding EF uniforms while searching through a box of magazines. What follows comes from the December 1999 Babylon 5/Crusade magazine and is by producer John Copeland:
quote:...the ranking system was kind of created by Joe, and then we sort of worked (with continuity) an ongoing basis in the series.
It's really a blend of Navy and Air Force ranks, but we didn't adhere strictly to only US military rankings. We tried to throw a little wider loop with some ranks from world military organizations. The wings on the sleeves of the EarthForce blues is also a nod to other military organizations, which is quite common in some European groups.
So, I've listed the ranks in groupings as a breakdown. Each rank listed second or third is lower than the first, except for Admiral and General (i.e. Lieutneant Colonels are lower than Colonels.)
Admiral/General: They are of equal standing, however Admirals (and one reason we didn't see them) are fleet (as in Pacific Fleet, or Atlantic Fleet) commanders. Generals (at least in our series) tend to be involved still on a the tactical level. General Frankliin and General Hauge are two examples of tactical apperances on the show.
Colonels, Lt. Colonels, Majors: This is why Major Krantz outranked Sheridan, because Captains come next in the order.
Captain, Commander, Lt. Commander: The two commander ranks tuck back into the Naval system.
Lieutenant, 1st Lieutenant and Ensign: These are the next levels coming down the ladder.
Security Chief: (As in Garibaldi) Even though Garibaldi was really, technically, outside the military. We never really explored how EarthForce Security worked in tandem with the military. I have also thought they were like the Air Police or AirForce, but again we never set that in stone.
And then we go into the regular ranks. Our chevrons and all were based on the British versions. Some of our officers, like Maj. Krantz, wore British style pips of rank...
Hope that helps. It still, however, leaves a few questions upon further reflection. For example, the Majors being of higher rank than Captains. Then, why did Major Krantz (from "Babylon Squared," Copeland misremebers which Major came abord B5 in "Severed Dreams." That was Major Ryan) salute Commander Sinclair first upon common aboard B4. Traditionally, the lower rank officer salutes the higher ranking officer first, then the higher ranking officer returns the salute.
Oh, well... early episode mistakes like Spock's stripes in the first season of Trek. He was a Lt. Commander in then and had full Commander's stripes.
posted
I was about to say! Sheridan and Krantz never met. . . and Krantz didn't even act all that superior to Sinclair. Although having had all sorts of flashbacks and flashforwards messing with your brain would upset anyone.
posted
Thanks for that article. I get the impression that Copeland doesn't know what he's writing about.
He confuses Krantz with Ryan. He doesn't know that Garibaldi was referred to as Chief Warrant Officer. He doesn't mention the rank Lt. JG, which was used in B5 IIRC. Instead he mixes Army and Navy ranks (Lt., 1st Lt., Ensign). And I find it very odd that the Army ranks Colonel, Lt. Colonel, and Major are higher ranking than Capt., Cmdr., and Lt. Cmdr.
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posted
Especially as they're just the equivilents of each other. (in real life, that is)
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posted
Of course, let's not forget that Ryan in "Severed Dreams" never really acted superior to Sheridan. There was no deferment to either Ryan or Sheridan. They seemed to treat each other on equal footing.
Also, even though we've seen mostly generals in EarthForce; there have to be Admirals, but not because Copeland says there are. There is evidence within the show itself.
In "And the Sky Full of Stars," Knight One says to Sinclair, "Good money had you'd make Admiral one day. What happen?"
quote:Originally posted by Middy Seafort: Of course, let's not forget that Ryan in "Severed Dreams" never really acted superior to Sheridan. There was no deferment to either Ryan or Sheridan. They seemed to treat each other on equal footing.
My point exactly. There are enough inaccuracies in Copeland's list to make it dubious; I'm not going to see EA-Major as superior to EA-Captain just because he says so.
posted
I agree with you Vogan Poet. Despite JMS' assertation that Copeland was the "military expert," his breaking down of the ranks makes no sense military-wise. I grew up with the US Navy and have studied at great lenght the Royal Navy as a hobby, and the combined service of the EarthForce as John Copeland describes is non-sequitar IMHO.
It is, however, an interesting bit of information on the supposed canon of Babylon 5.
posted
For one thing, in "Severed Dreams" Major Ryan basically deferred to Sheridan completely for tactical planning and the overall strategy. Like when they got the news that Clark was sending in the heavy reinforcements, Ryan offered to run and try to create a diversion. I don't think that something like that can be explained by Sheridan being military governor of local space.
I can't be bothered to check back over 6 pages worth of material, so this might have been mentioned before... but was the CO of the Hyperion in "A Voice in the Wilderness" a Captain? I remember there was a big fight over who had ultimate authority in certain situations... but it seems strange, regardless.
It makes little sense to have two concurrent rank systems get split apart and stacked on top of each other. I think that a continuing concurrence makes more sense... mostly. Actually, the first explanation, about Admirals and Generals, actually DOES make a bit of sense, IMO. Well, maybe. On second thought, the EarthForce Chief of Staff (Hague) was "only" a general, so I guess that nixes that. (Even more than that, why would a general, still involved in the tactics rather than the strategy, be Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff?)
Ergh... back to square one, mostly.
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posted
I think the Hyperion's commander was a Captain. . . His attitude seemed to be a mix of "I outrank you" with "However, we're both commanding officers so I don't want to step on your toes too much."
There are a couple of good shots of the pilot varient of the EF uniforms, including a shot where you can tell Ben Kyle's jacket is a slightly different color from Sinclair's and Takashima's.
posted
Does anyone know what the rank insignia of General O'Reilly ("Point of No Return) and General Lefcourt ("Endgame") look like?
-------------------- "Never give up. And never, under any circumstances, no matter what - never face the facts." - Ruth Gordon
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