I do like your idea about the design being slightly varied from ship to ship. The Valiant certainly looks slightly different than the USS Defiant. Maybe those forward escape pods were relocated on the Valiant and there really is only 4 in that area.

I can admit (and hope) that there may be more pods stashed somewhere we haven't seen. It's just a matter of where. I find it hard to believe that those 6 impulse engine pods (from Drexler's plans) exist, though.

The problem is, if the ship's going to explode, just being in a lifepod will not save you. Being in a lifepod that's very far away from the explosions will save you, and it takes time to get to a safe distance. I'd rather spend most of those 15 seconds getting away from the about-to-explode ship than running from one end to another trying to find a lifepod that wasn't full up. After all, if an explosion can destroy the ship, it can just as easily destroy the life pods! After all, they aren't bomb shelters. That's why they don't just pop out of the ship, but scoot away as fast as they can go.

--Baloo

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If you speak and no-one listens, it still counts as long as YOU have learned something.
www.geocities.com/Area51/Shire/8641/

I agree with Baloo about escape pods. The visible hatches seem a bit too far apart to represent the -only- pods. On the other hand, the ship is only occupied in specific locations during normal operation time. The pattern of these would only change as different quarters are occupied in changing shifts, during alert conditions or other specialized missions (can you think of anything else?)

In other words, some measure of redundancy is necessary, but it need not be much greater than what we see onscreen.

As for the rest of the unknown info: three people hold 90% of it. Jim Martin who designed the ship, Gary Hutzel who supervised not only the visual effects for half the episodes, but also the design process and building of the miniature, and finally, Doug Drexler, who is responsible for much of the Defiant's scenic art. The problem is that we cannot contact Any of these by e-mail.

I'm thinking of sending them snail-mail, but I'm not sure that Hutzel works for Trek any longer (no more DS9), I know Martin was replaced by John Eaves in season 4, while Drexler is now working for Foundation. Perhaps their former companies would be so kind to forward their mail

Boris

I mostly do agree with the plans but some aspects of them are hard to swallow. The Targeting Sensor thing is about the worst. The impulse engine pods doesn't impress me either. There's a few other things I could bitch about, too. Ever tried measuring the length of the bridge? Anyway, the plans do work if taken as a general guide to the ships layout.

Like I've admitted before, there could be more pods than what we've seen. It is a very small ship, though, and under most cases wouldn't have more than 50 crew.

It would certainly be good to get more info from Martin, Hutzel, and Drexler.

Sure, the blueprints need some explaining. They can be considered misinformation within the context of the manual, but as for those seen onscreen, I really do hope that they have a function of switching between features which can not be viewed simultaneously due to overlap, or presenting customized views of certain systems and not others. This would allow us to add more systems to Drexler's blueprints, but the rest of the details, as well as the presence of different systems in the same absolute location might be more difficult to explain away.

The 'targeting sensor' situation is a testament to the notion that very few DS9 people actually reviewed the book. It's just awful how they missed such an obvious placement. Still, if we go beyond the canon and into production sketches, those triangles are alternatively labeled as "weapons", "weapons modules", and "weapons system". A targeting sensor *could* be considered one of the (swappable?) weapons modules (it's a weapon in a Way...).

*If* these launchers are actually modular, then there probably exist on the Defiant a number of standard forward torpedo launchers, which are used whenever the modules serve a different function. It might explain the situation with the MSD, the two launchers in the deflector nose being an obvious choice.

Boris

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"Wrong again. Although we want to be scientifically accurate, we've found that selection of [Photon Energy Plasma Scientifically Inaccurate as a major Star Trek format error] usually indicates a preoccupation with science and gadgetry over people and story."

---a Writers' Test from the Original Series Writer's Guide

Like you've said, though, it is possible that parts of the ship are swapable or have been modified/moved over time. After all, it is an experimental class.

Side note- since there is no longer an NX ship does that mean the class isn't experimental anymore?

I just thought of something. Did the Sao Paulo get a cloak when it was renamed the Defiant?

And the aft launcher situation is something I wanted to ask you about. I looked at the "Paradise Lost" clip at Maximum Defiant, and the Defiant is facing the camera while firing torpedo, besides the fact that it banks away as it's firing. The actual location seems rather ambiguous, I'm not sure that I could pinpoint it as precisely as you did (but then again, I only have a tiny movie...)

Furthermore, we have two dialogue lines: "aft torpedo, fire" and "we've lost our aft torpedo launcher". The obvious interepretation of the latter is that of a single aft torpedo launcher, but given the rest of evidence, Dax might have simply been careless with her wording. The former line merely indicates that an aft torpedo is to be fired.

As for the cloak, I wouldn't be surprised if it's available in every Defiant nowdays. First we've had a Romulan guarding it, followed by no Romulans in exchange for info, followed by its use in the Alpha Quadrant...I'm sure the writers will have conveniently 'forgotten' about the whole thing by now, just as the Voyager producers have forgotten about the low torpedo and shuttle supply. Starfleet can probably construct further devices, it's only the Treaty of Algeron that forbade it until now.

I did an -entire page- on the Defiant, never worrying about the cloaking situation or mentioning it. Just realized that now. To be added: "First Federation ship with a cloaking device."

As for the NX-situation, I think the intention is to have the NCC- ships be more static in their configuration, and at the same time equipped with systems that had been previously tested on the Defiant. The poor thing was built in only four years (www.ASDB.net people, great pages but you gotta shift those dates back a little, DS9TM's wrong again....), and much of its primary systems probably went untested. What do you think?

Boris

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"Wrong again. Although we want to be scientifically accurate, we've found that selection of [Photon Energy Plasma Scientifically Inaccurate as a major Star Trek format error] usually indicates a preoccupation with science and gadgetry over people and story."

---a Writers' Test from the Original Series Writer's Guide

We also have the problem of the nose phaser that fires in "Paradise Lost". It's difficult to tell where exactly it comes from in "PL". I remember hearing that that phaser also fired in "Message in a Bottle". Is it possible to pinpoint an exact location in "MiaB"?

Drexler's MSD and plans also shows a tractor emitter in the nose. But, like the torp launchers, it has never been seen used.

Going by my CIC copy of "Paradise Lost", the aft launcher is located somewhere near the centre of that step. It's annoying how the miniature doesn't have any indication where the aft tube(s) should be.

All: I'd be surprised if any but the NX Defiant had a cloak. The Valiant obviously didn't have one. Admittedly, I haven't seen the Sao.

I conjecture that the Defiant originally went into limited production yet remained an experimental class. It's probably now considered a production class, though.

1. There's a scene where a probe is launched from that hole in the deflector. This proves that Drexler's nose launcher(s) exists.

2. Just after the probe scene there is an explosion that rocks the Defiant (the collapsing artificial wormhole). Jadzia reports that "there's a hull breach on deck 5".

The Defiant deflector must be similar to the BoP and K't'inga ones - deflection and torp launcher integrated into the single same array.

I don't know what to say about the deck 5 quote, other than I know "To the Death" also mentions a deck 5.

Oh yeah, I watched "MiaB". I didn't see either of the Defiants fire from their deflector - only their pulse phaser cannons.

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"Forgive me if I don't share your euphoria!" (Weyoun to Dukat, Tears of the Prophets)
Dax's Ships of STAR TREK

"The Way of the Warrior" has a hull breach on "decks 2, 3, and 5" which makes three eps. That's pretty conclusive, and I wonder whether the little teeny space below Deck 4 in the MSD is sufficiently high (or even ceiling-less) in some areas, in order to allow Sisko to walk on it.

I rewatched the little clip of "Paradise Lost", and still cannot observe the exact spot of the torpedo's departure (perhaps the frame is missing in the quicktime?). A couple of seconds before the launch, the Defiant fires a phaser from what appears to be our versatile deflector hole, then a full volley of pulse phasers, followed by a quick upside-down turn that allows it to fire the bridge emitter onto the Lakota saucer-top.

Dax: Could you please check whether the first phaser actually comes from the nose or the bridge? Also, where does the fire come from in "Starship Down"? Which episode does the hole-phaser picture on my website come from?

Boris

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"Wrong again. Although we want to be scientifically accurate, we've found that selection of [Photon Energy Plasma Scientifically Inaccurate as a major Star Trek format error] usually indicates a preoccupation with science and gadgetry over people and story."

---a Writers' Test from the Original Series Writer's Guide

The first phaser blast in "PL" is so quick you'd miss it if you blinked. Anyway, although the ship is far away, it clearly comes from the nose. The exact location is unclear because of the distance from the "camera".

The fire in "Starship Down" comes from the deflector hole. Remember though, this is the deflector modified to act as a phaser emitter - not an emitter by design. This shot only works once and burns out the deflector.

That picture on your website is actually from "Rejoined". It isn't a phaser blast at all. It's a depiction of the deflector being used to emit some sort of special beam. In the ep they are working towards creating an artificial wormhole. That beam is the beginning of the process.