quote:Originally posted by Vogon Poet: What was wrong with Janeway Sr.'s uniform, apart from having a late-model commbadge?
IIRC the episode established that he died in the 2350s, but his rank insignia was introduced in 2365, his sleeve bands in 2369, and his communicator in 2371.
BTW: Does anyone have screenshots from Giotto, Finney, and Mendez' dress uniform?
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The CO of my ship is a CDR but called captain. DS9 stated it perfectly, despite rank, the CO of a ship is always called captain.
I never really paid attention to admiral ranks since I don't think they were ever really set in stone.
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quote:Originally posted by Spike: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Vogon Poet: [qb]Does anyone have screenshots from Giotto, Finney, and Mendez' dress uniform?
Finney never wore a dress uniform, being presumed dead until the end of "Court Martial."
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Tuvok's rank change/correction occured about 2/3rds of the way though season 1, IIRC.
Actually, there's something else about that that's bene bugging me. I think we can assume that the Lt Commander pips were a mistake. But, in addition to that, weren't they also backwards (ie, the black pip was closest to the front, not the back)?
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quote:Originally posted by Spike: There's a memo in The Making of TMP which nailed down the sleeve stripes. One broken stripe is for Ensigns. They totally forgot about Lt. JG. That explains why Chekov was promoted from Ensign two full Lt., while Scotty, McCoy, Uhura, and Sulu only got a one-step promotion.
Nevertheless, this is one instance in which (at least IMO) the behind-the-scenes information cannot be reconciled with what was seen onscreen. We know Lt. JG was a rank in the TOS period a few years before TMP (witness Tollerman in "The Naked Time") and we know it was also one a few years after the film in TWOK. So, the suggestion that for a brief period during the 2270s the rank didn't exist is simply not credible to me. The omission was clearly a mere oversight by the costume department. Therefore, to my thinking, it is an "error."
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quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: Tuvok's rank change/correction occured about 2/3rds of the way though season 1, IIRC.
Actually, there's something else about that that's bene bugging me. I think we can assume that the Lt Commander pips were a mistake. But, in addition to that, weren't they also backwards (ie, the black pip was closest to the front, not the back)?
As for Chakotay being a Lt. Cmdr. or full Commander, he was addressed as a "Commander", much the same as Data and Worf and LaForge were addressed as "Commander" quite often, so it can go either way. However, Janeway referred to him as Commander Chakotay while he was little more than a Maqui fugitive, so possibly that was his rank when he resigned as the case may be.
Well, in the above mentioned episode where I stated Tuvok got demoted "Prime Factors" he was dressed down by the Captain and given a reprimand and whatnot, and it would seem reasonable that with the given information and no more without rewatching it that he may have been demoted either on or off screen, since we did see him as a Lt Cmdr in the pilot, and then again saw him be promoted to that position in "Revulsion", then again, I recently rewatched "The 37's" where he was again Lt Cmdr (by pips) but he called himself "Lt. Tuvok" in dialog, so maybe there is no damn explaination whatsoever to resolve this, or....maybe I am just a wanton junior member desperate to be heard!
[ February 07, 2003, 03:09 AM: Message edited by: Futurama Guy ]
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quote:Finney never wore a dress uniform, being presumed dead until the end of "Court Martial."
Sorry, I meant Finney's and Giotto's duty uniform and Mendez' dress uniform.
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I noticed in "Loud As A Whisper" TNG that there was a female helm/conn (whatever) that didnt have any pips at all on her uinform. I realize it might be due to the budget or something, but would this be significant?
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I'm quite sure that, while he was wearing Lt. Cmdr. pips, Tuvok was referred to as "Lieutenant" more than once - if not always.
Anyone know the exact episode in which the pips were changed? IIRC it was a few weeks after "Prime Factors". Maybe Janeway waited for the result of an official investigation before demoting Tuvok and Tom?
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quote:Maybe Janeway waited for the result of an official investigation before demoting Tuvok and Tom?
IIRC Tom had nothing to do with that incident. I heard the rumour that TPTB demoted Tom after they fixed Tuvok's rank pips, so that Tuvok was still higher ranking than Paris.
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OK... Tuvok was NOT demoted on screen. Whether he was off screen or not is debatable, but he was not demoted on screen. He was dressed down, yes, but when he told Janeway that he expected to lose his commission, Janeway said no. All we saw on screen is Janeway getting on his case and giving her standard disappointment speech.
And he was never referred to as Commander until his official promotion to Lt. Commander later in the series.
The story about Tom's rank being fixed the same time as Tuvok's makes sense, though I've never heard that one before. So, one more question: What rank was B'lanna (SP?)? She told Tom that they were the same rank, so if Tom was always *supposed* to be a Lt. JG, would that make BLT a JG, as well? Anyone have a clear shot of her provisional rank insignia?
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I'm sure I Looked closely once, it was a JG insignia.
Meanwhile, I always have this bizarre memory of Tuvok wearing Lt. Cdr. insignia - but with the pips the wrong way round, so the black pip was on the left. . . But I've re-watched many of the early eps and never saw that in any of them.
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