posted
Remember guys, the Stargazer WAS originally supposed to be a Connie. They changed it for "The Battle" and didn't look back, but I see no reason a newbuild Constitution from the later movie era can't survive to the TNG era. Perhaps it's also a trainer, akin to the Republic (which I believe to be THE Republic), except capable of warp. Every last ship, every last man, folks.
Besides, we already put one in the trailer, which is oddly enough banged up just like the E-nil saucer appearance... And with the components we're building for the Saratoga, it's plenty easy to slap together a standard Reliant and enough of a Connie to make it worth the time designing it. The Dominion War variant, too.
WizArtist II
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quote:Originally posted by Shik: Constitution. Or Constellation. There was no wooden America.
And....alas there is no U.S.S. America anymore... Davy Jones
AND they intend to decommission the Enterprise sometime in 2013. Hopefully, they'll name the first of the new CV21 class Enterprise. THAT won't muck with Trek AT ALL.
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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Yeah, they sunk her to see just what a supercarrier can take in terms of hits.
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There is a wooden America though- it's a modern re-creation (no idea if there was ever such a ship back in the day), but the point stands: 100 year-old de-commisioned ships would not be called upon to fight an enemy that far outclasses even your most advanced ships.
It accomplishes nothing and gets the crew (sizeable, even if it was an Academy trainer) killed.
The argument that the Miranda and Excelsior classes served leading roles in the Dominion War is muted by the attrition in ships Starfleet suffered during the war's opening months and the loss of (at least one of) their shipyards. They had time to de-mothball (Polaris) and refit (Lakota) older ships to a (somewhat) capable force. The "fleet" assembled at W359 would have been thrwn together in days at most: no time to use anything not ready, and after the Borh handily creamed the Lalo and the Enterprise's weapons did nothing, I cant see any capable admiral sending "whatever they had" into combat. Better by far to be in hock to te Klingons (and Romulans!) for saving your ass.
At least useing the "challenger" configuration, we can assume the ship is used as a freighter or science ship within the safety of the UFP and got drafted because it was within range (the smae reason there was not a larger force).
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Ooow, where can Shakaar sign up on this project?! *takes over direction* *ponders* First... we shall remove all the instances of "Emmisary" on the webpage and replace them with "Emissary".
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quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: And yet there was an Oberth there...
Back to the original supposition then - there was a Constitution there, as though it were just old, like the Constellation herself.
Mark
That was my thinking as well. If there can be ships in service as old as the Oberth, Miranda and Excelsior, then I can't see any reason why a more recent class of ship such as the Constellation wouldn't be in use.
As for the Hathaway, that was just a throwaway suggestion(I don't like fan fiction that brings together old characters and ships in contrived situations), but there's no evidence that the ship would take too long to be made operational. It could've been brought back into service for all we know. It's not as though it was unable to fly in Peak Performance. It even managed warp.
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: And yet there was an Oberth there...
Back to the original supposition then - there was a Constitution there, as though it were just old, like the Constellation herself.
Mark
It's silly because (unlike the Oberth) the Constitution had been decomissioned. For you now...decades.
Might as well toss in the FJ ships as well.
Hmmm...of course, if you were to use the Connie, it would be soooo miniscule next to the Cube as to be a gnat, One tenth the width and less than one thirtieth the height.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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quote:Jason orally spuzzed out: 100 year-old de-commisioned ships would not be called upon to fight an enemy that far outclasses even your most advanced ships.
The USN kept 3 Des Moines-class heavy cruisers in mothballs in Philly for something like 50 years..."just in case."
The funny thing is, we forget that in space--a vacuum--there's none of the usual "wear & tear" that we associate with oceangoing navies. For the USN, a 45-year-old vessel is an antique; the Brazilians, on the other hand, have a riverine craft in their navy dating to a 1937 launch. Still in service.
I've no problem with old-ass ships still being in service; it would help a lot with the expanding frontiers (remember all that "exploration" nonsense?" & unless there was some form of severe structural anomalies, no reason for a ship build in the late 2260s to not be in service., even if it's in a reduced fleet supporrt role. (such as Lantree)
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Yup. Incidentally, I think the three Des Moines were the last ships left that were designated as "heavy cruisers"...
And we have absolutely no canon mention about the decommissioning of the Constitution class as a whole. Only the Enterprise-A, and even that is generally accepted as being a renamed older ship. If the Feds had kept making new Constitution class ships into the 2270s, there should be no reason a relatively unworn example shouldn't be active in SOME role in 2366. Maybe as a freighter, a patrol ship, who knows? MY question to you guys is whether we should make this Connie a pre-exisitng one whose name we know, or make one up and give her an NCC in the upper XXXX range.
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WizArtist II
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WHAT!?!?! No "Argo", "Glorious", "Idefatigable", "Foch", "Vikrant", or "Giuseppe Garibaldi"....
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
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I think some of those are Excelsiors. Maybe. I'd have to look. It's on the other computer that this silly twat is using...cute as she is, though.
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While wear-and-tear is not a (big) consideration, the march of progress certainly is. Consider, the Federation expanded by leaps and bounds since the heyday of the Connie Refit as new races and their tech joined the melting pot of Starfleet.
On a lesser scale, the Romulans and Klingons also greatly improved their tech.
This severe out distancing between the tech standards of the TOS to TNG era (and the fact that we never saw a Connie on TNG but did see every other old ship design in service) leads me to believe that (like the Soyuz) the old class was completely de-comissioned or is, at most, serving with severe automation in "home fleet" defense for low-risk colonies or as the occasional trainer for private commercial intrests (i've never thought commerce was or could be under Starfleet's control).
Taking the example of the DeMoines class ships "kept just in case", imagine some foreign power makes one uber-battleship that cruise missiles and nuclear warheads cant scratch: does the US Navy crew up it's obsolete Demonies class ships with able bodied victi...er....sailors and send them to fight said uber-ship?
Fuck no.
Thus, I speculate that, if it is a Connie refit, it may have been a civillian ship (even a passanger liner) that responded to the first distress calls or was pressed into service as emergency evac/hospital duty and got destroyed along with the others. But not part of the intended "fleet".
quote: MY question to you guys is whether we should make this Connie a pre-exisitng one whose name we know, or make one up and give her an NCC in the upper XXXX range.
I'd give it an old name and number, but something other than the "NCC" prefix to indicate a change from active fleet status.
Didn't we see an Oberth with a non-NCC registry on TNG?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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The original series presents us with one reason for not seeing many Constitutions in the future, namely, most of them were blown up, eaten, fell into alternate universes, had their entire crew reduced to powder, and so on.
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