posted
Darth Maul was raised by Palp and essentially trained as a Jedi-killing machine. Dooku, methinks, had his own plans going on and was never really all that trusted by Palpatine.
We know that Dooku knew it was Sideous' plan all along to start a war by playing both sides. It was Dooku who hired Jango for the Clone project. It was also Dooku who led the seperatist movement. So he knew part of the plan. Knowing Sideous' real motivations would seem to necessitate Dooku knowing Sidious and Palp are one in the same, but Sidious could have been telling him a story about why he wanted war to start. He could have just been feeding him the Sith party line: "It will get rid of the Jedi for us."
But, Dooku did shoot Palp a rather shocked look when he told Anakin to kill him. Whatever the case, Palpatine has obviously been manipulating Anakin all his life, patiently waiting until he was powerful enough to be of use to him.
posted
Mabye palpy did not trust even a former Jedi with the whole plan. Vader is also a tool, but a little better informed, I guess.
What's strange is that Palpy makes this elaborate scheme to gain power, wipe out the Jedi and turn Anakin but somewhere along the line, he grows complacent and lets the Rebel Alliance become a real threat.
Mabye he was just bored.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
Well I recently saw the movie and thought it was pretty good.
I'm pretty sure palpy knows a Rebellion will rise. They would be the kind of enemy palpy could scapegoat and use to justify his regime.
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quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women: Well I recently saw the movie and thought it was pretty good.
I'm pretty sure palpy knows a Rebellion will rise. They would be the kind of enemy palpy could scapegoat and use to justify his regime.
In addition, he had to have known that not everyone would bend the knee to him when he took power. From the actions of Bail Organa, we see that, in a sense, the rebellion was born the minute Palpatine had the Jedi killed and declared himself Emperor. I find it unlikely that there weren't others who shared Bail's sentiments from the outset, and, as someone already mentioned, the ex-separatists would have been ripe for recruitment, especially if it could be shown that Palpatine manipulated them to grab power in the first place.
Obviously, Palpatine was not 100% confident that the entire galaxy would be blindly loyal to him or else he would not have needed to waste considerable resources in the construction of the Death Star (not to mention sacrificing the lives of thousands of innocent independent contractors who were just trying to make a living).
Was the moon (or moon-like, I suppose that it could be a planet) that Bail took Yoda and Obi-Wan to supposed to be Dantooine (probably misspelled�the abandoned rebel base that Leia tells Vader about in Ep IV.)
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WizArtist II
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posted
Seeing Obi- lament "You were the chosen one! you were supposed to bring balance to the force" kind of made me chuckle. When you really think about it, old Ani did just that at that point. It was Vader and Palpy on one side and Obi and the spinning green booger on the other. 2 against 2. pretty balanced to me.
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
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posted
Apparently not. The Extended Universe (in this case, the "making of" or "secrets of" books on ROTS) mentions a mysteriously demolished inhabited planet whose ruins are being studied by the weird palefaces whom we see tending the asteroid station. I forget the name, but it's not Dantooine. In the EU, this isn't a Jedi "safe house" even if the movie makes it look like one - it's a random location of helpful bystanders, and apparently never becomes a Rebel base or anything. That is, if you believe in the EU.
quote:Originally posted by Aban Rune: We know that Dooku knew it was Sideous' plan all along to start a war by playing both sides. It was Dooku who hired Jango for the Clone project.
Outside of the Bounty Hunter video game, what other sorce is there for Dooku hiring Jango Fett.
Since Jango was recruited by Dooku, then it stands to reason that the "Sifo Dyas requesting the clones be made" backstory is a bit of a stretch. Either he didn't really have altruistic motives or someone impersonated him.
I'm having a discussion on another DB about this point and need more info, since I've not kept up on the EU.
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quote:Originally posted by WizArtist II: Seeing Obi- lament "You were the chosen one! you were supposed to bring balance to the force" kind of made me chuckle. When you really think about it, old Ani did just that at that point. It was Vader and Palpy on one side and Obi and the spinning green booger on the other. 2 against 2. pretty balanced to me.
Except that after Jedi, the Empire falls, there's only one Jedi (and Leia could be trained I guess) and no Sith.
Not much balance in a happy ending though.
(shrugs)
The perefect ending would have been to have the Emperor escape, add a big "?" aftet "The End". ...and Palpy's laughter as the credits roll. And Queen could do the soundtrack.
Okay, that idea sucks- only an idiot would make such a movie.
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quote:Outside of the Bounty Hunter video game, what other sorce is there for Dooku hiring Jango Fett
It's right in the movie. Kenobi pressures Jango Fett on his potential contact with Master Sifo-Dyas, to which Fett responds "don't know about that, I was hired by a man named Tyranus" (paraphrased). Darth Tyranus being Dooku.
I would've liked to have gotten more coverage on Sifo-Dyas' story, though.
Obi Juan:
quote:Was the moon (or moon-like, I suppose that it could be a planet) that Bail took Yoda and Obi-Wan to supposed to be Dantooine (probably misspelled�the abandoned rebel base that Leia tells Vader about in Ep IV.)
posted
You could argue that the "balance" brought to the force is that someone could use the Dark side, understand it, and then release himself from it. In the end, Luke WAS using the dark side in defeating Vader, but didn't let it consume him, as he rejected it's influence when the moment had passed. Maybe Anakin brought balance to the force by having progeny that could master it in a way he couldn't.
Or more likely Lucas was doing revisionist crap again.
-------------------- "Well, I mean, it's generally understood that, of all of the people in the world, Mike Nelson is the best." -- ULTRA MAGNUS, steadfast in curmudgeon
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posted
I could also argue that there is zero accountability in Star Wars. Vader kills the a bunch of children, all the Jedis in the temple, is an accessory to the mass murder of an entire planet and is redemmed by killing ONE old man who happens to be more evil than he is?
Fuuuck that.
The end of Jedi should have been of Obi Wan and Yoda's spirits drinking beers while Anakin burns in hell forever.
Mabye it'll happen in Lucas' 15th revision.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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posted
Actually that's one thing I always thought of - Qui Gon was wrong - well to a point. Anakin did bring about balance to the force - by having Luke and Leia. But what was the imbalance to begin with - they never really established this firmly in Episode 1.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
posted
Or they just got the prophecy out of a crackerjack box.
I dont think even the EU (with it's sillyness) has tackled the origins of that particular plot device.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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Actually, after looking at other Star Wars stories and plots, I've come to appreciate the distinctions between Jedi and Sith. Getting someone like Vader to feel mercy, pity, obligation (to save his son) and sacrifice is an extremely big thing where the ethics of the Star Wars mythos is concerned.
Deaths and losses are irrelevant in the universe of Star Wars, the state of your soul and mind is what the Force works through, it seems. Taking such a step as Vader did was momentous.
AndrewR:
quote:But what was the imbalance to begin with - they never really established this firmly in Episode 1.
I would say that the state of the galaxy during the last years of the Old Republic was one of a greatly dispersed amount of Light Force users and a small number of very powerful Dark Force users, not having had a "stirring of the pot" for a great many generations.
Similar to the state of Middle Earth during the watchful peace between Sauron's first downfall and his final one, the Jedi and the Republic had come a long way but were still haunted by several different internal and external threats, predominantly the dormant Sith.
After Vader's, Yoda's and Palpatine's deaths in the course of only a few days, the balance of the Force was probably shifted a great deal, wiping the slate clean, as it were.
I could compare Yoda and Palpatine to Gandalf and Sauron/The Balrog. Their might and prowess was considerable but they were not supposed to stay and retain their power indefinately and after their "passing" the pieces of the board could be allowed to shift a great deal.
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