quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: While it was never made clear in dialogue, the Hunters/TOsk were always itended to be Dominion members. The writers had meant to staff the large dominion cruisers (Dukat's) with Wadi and Hunter technicians alongside the Jem'Hadar (who serve only as shock troops). The idea was to imply a link between the Tosk's invisibility and the Jem'Hadar's shrouding-
I think it was probably for the best that those species were excluded- though it may have been nice to have first season tie-ins. When we look at all the species that were absorbed into the Dominion, there was always a high degree of discontent, the Dosi, Karemma seemed willing to trade or give information on the Dominion, the Founders didn't trust the Breen, the Cardassians betrayed them, I'm sure many of the solid species probably did. When you treat them as disposable though- they probably would have to expect that species forced into service would betray them at the most opportune time. ...and when you can clone species that will follow you as a god, that are willing to die for you, why bother with solids? Jem'Hadar were not only shock troops, they were intelligent too- when the Defiant was commandeered in "One Little Ship" it was noted how quickly the Jem'Hadar were learning all the ship's systems and would not be fooled long.
I wish they would have made a connection between the Hunters and the Founders though, not only for Tosk�s ability to shroud- but it was mentioned that at one point in their history, the Tosk was not a truly sentient species- that the Hunters had bred/engineered the Tosk- which could have been shared with the Dominion.
Registered: Dec 2005
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Yeah - not so much the Wadi tie-in - but the Tosk and the Hunters of the Tosk would have been good to have been seen in the Dominion.
I remember in an online Chat - I asked Ron Moore or Robert Hewitt Wolfe - I can't remember - of even Ira Behr - who did the Engineering duties for the dominion as I think the Jem'Hadar would have lacked the finess to repair technical systems. The TOSK - looked like he knew - that would have been cool.
The Vorta would never get their hands dirty in a warp core. I can't remember the response - it was over at Trek Web. Probably about 1998.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
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The whole point ws that the Dominion was the "anti-Federation" in that they would subjegate entire developing worlds, and raise the overall qulaity of life through technology, but would have to serve...or get the axe (as the race from "The Quickening" did).
I'm sure that most of the Dominionj worlds are faithful simply because they are in a better position than they ever were before their first contact (and because, if they stay in line and contribute rescouces to the Dominion, they're left alone to do whatever- like the Oompa-Loompas that sold Quark the Tueleberry Wine).
The Oompa Loompas would have made good technicians. Karrema too- they cant all be willing to risk Dominion retaliation by dealing with the UFP.
Also consider Weyun's line about the Dominion existing for 2000 years- some of their member worlds would have been part of the Dominion for hundreds of generations- not being part of the Dominion would be unthinkable to them. Every oppressive empire still has countries with strong imperial pride (like the USSR, I suppose).
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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I know the Dominion must have had a number of members that were forced to participate in trade and other areas- but since we've seen a great deal of their military, and there has never been a non-engineered species serving on a ship. I would tend to discount their existence. Jem'Hadar are smart- and are also pre-programmed to follow the Founders, to follow the Vorta in the Founders place, but see themselves as superior to all other life.
I would also be less accepting of the idea that every race we saw from the Gamma Quadrant are part of the Dominion- most of the first season there was little mention of them- some didn't seem to know of the Dominion, so I ponder the Gamma Quadrant end of the wormhole was not within Dominion space (at least originally). The Skreeans said they were being oppressed by the T-Rogorans, who had just been conquered by �Something called the Dominion� which they escaped from in the resulting chaos. So though the Dominion was founded 2000 years ago (and if a species held to having offspring at 25 years of age- there would be but 80 generations not hundreds) it is clear that species around the entrance of the wormhole only had contact with the Dominion within their lifetimes.
But again it would have been neat to have the Hunter's/Tosk tied in- They could have been chasing him from far off, even from within the Dominion. Tosk also knew his place, another characteristic that the Jem�Hadar have.
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I've also made a map (2d)- You've probably seen a similar one to mine as it is based off a map used by RPers, but I pondered I'd share it: http://www.craigdannenberg.com/bajor/mapnew.gif
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Oh.. dont know about that. The Oompa Loompas knew well enough...though the Idran system and it's surrounding systems were not actually within Dominion territory. I'd think there are parts of the Alpha Quadrant outside the major empires, that have never heard of the UFP.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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I don't know who you're trying to refer to, but take the Karemma for instance. If I recall correctly they claim they'd never even met a Vorta. They just sent data and I guess taxes to some distant location. And, of course, nobody seemed to know about the Founders.
So, as I said, all the Dominion citizens we saw (in the Gamma Quadrant) apparently had only indistinct ideas about what the Dominion was and how it operated.
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No doubt the Karemma were in relative periphery; more closely integrated worlds might be found deeper in. It's difficult to judge how much deeper, though.
Runabouts were able to get "three weeks" away from the closest known Dominion holdings in "The Ship". Does that mean that the heroes really flew for three weeks (or more like three months, considering that runabouts aren't exactly the cheetahs of the Trek savannah)? Or does it mean that the closest known Dominion holdings were 2.5 weeks away from the wormhole vicinity to begin with?
Probably the borders of the Dominion are really fuzzy. It's also possible, though, that there is no great difference between core and periphery when it comes to having contact with the Vorta or knowledge of the Founders. Perhaps only a select few "raisins in the dough" have factual knowledge, having been punished for a misdemeanor.
Certainly the Founders would prefer a decentralized model: all the less chance that Solids could take over the operation, or that somebody could figure out basic spatial geometry and hit the administrative bullseye of the empire. The Founders were apparently hiding outside Dominion proper both prior to "Die is Cast" and after...
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That last idea never flew with me- why would the Founders want a world outside their own defenses? I figured either the new world was well within their protective boundries, they had a concealed fleet withing a minutes notice for defense, or they simply moved locations every so often and Odo got the "current" homeworld's coordinates from the Female Founder in WYLB.
Sol, by "Oompa Loompas" I mean the Dosi from Rules of Acquisition. It's just how I think of them, I guess. (shrugs)
The Karemma never alluded to "never seeing a Vorta"- they seem well versed with the Dominion and even sold the Jem Hadar their torpedos- I'm sure they went through a vorta for that.
The Karemma also recognised Jem Hadar ships on sight and panicked immeadeately- indicating a familliarity with their dangerous nature- they were real nervous about crossing their Dominion overlords.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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I have a question: where exactly is J-247 anyway? We know it's 7000 Ly from wherever Enterprise was at the episode's start, but where?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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That's a very interesting xenological directory you posted above, I'd not seen it before. I wish they would have given more information on each- they went through a lot of trouble to collect them all I ponder, but just gave a bear minimum of info on each. I kinda like how they paired up species that were seen on screen, but we never heard a name for, with those that names were mentioned that we never saw. I don't really like that they included the animated series into it, some are ok, but when a TNG species name was paired up with a TAS alien image it just seemed off.
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They also stamp UFP on any speices they can- Unless Bajor was admitted into the Federation without my knowledge *L*
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Yeah, but think of the fun you can have with Photoshop making those TAS aliens look plausable (nudge, nudge).
Bajor gets admitted in the (non-canon, but extremely well-written) DS9 books that start up eight months after the series ends.
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
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